he is not picked for other reason than being weak, he's actually rather strong.
check pick rates in competitive rather than in pubs.
i meant pubs - i know he's picked in competitive. he's a really good hero - i know exactly why he isn't picked - people are scared of a bit of micro...
patches are focused on competitive and high rated pubs (which have a lot in common, actually), therefore you cant really expect such a strong hero as visage to get a buff.
think again, because
"About as perfect a pub support as you could get - needs no items"
is wrong
"He also counters most of the meta heroes"
is also a blunt statement, it's too general
I know...but still it is a shame - it isn't like io needing coordination - this hero is a really strong pub hero who is ignored because of a perceived high skill floor.
He really shines with items, he was given some time to farm and was played almost like a core hero on by Aui C9/EG, I don't know about now because I haven't watched much competitive dota lately
@mokulin he counters every squishy hero that doesn't have a blink as soon as he gets his 6. he especially loves stealing 32% of blood's speed. the only ones he struggles with are storm, antimage and pl.
as for items, he gets enough gold from the "inevitable" killsteals with his nuke. all he dreams of is a medallion and aghs.
Drow strat with visage is pure anal perforation. Dont buff this hero.
Heros meta pick in competition. Too micro heavy for pubs.
^i guess it doesnt work anymore, the mechanics of drow's passive were changed in order to nerf this combo.
it's nerfed but it still works - the birds get the aura when it is active - it is only the permanent aura around drow that they no longer get. still works for splitpushing if that's your thing.
i know. the point here is that the active form of aura doesnt last long enough to make this combo strong.
Really love this hero. The reason he isn't picked isn't because he's weak though, or because there's no incentives. He does really well, and he recently even got an immortal. It just comes down to the fact that he's intimidating with the micro involved and many players have an awful experience their first time playing the hero with the -2 base armor and 10% magic resistance. As well so many builds tell you to go soul assumption level 1 which is just wrong. There aren't many good sources for learning how the hero works, he's complex and somewhat easily punished for bad positioning, and requires some amount of micro to get use out of.
http://www.dotabuff.com/players/198290295
There are a few others visage players i bump into every now and then.
Imo its just too boring hero to play also. your mana pool is too low if your playing support, if you want visaje go offlane. Thats only my personal opinion
Thats because Io isnt a hero but a simple buff to another hero. Hes like a tumor sticking to his host. You need to stack with your partner with a mic and all.
Visage need no items? maybe, but still is very good farming and decent splitpushing so why not farm :P?
This hero is like naga, chen, nobody plays them (and win) below 4.5k cause their decency skill floors are the highest
I know, rare pepe, but that's beside the point - the idea is that the OP thinks the data he's referencing means something.
Visage is ok without items, but if you buff him up with some survivability, he becomes ridiculously hard to kill, and can just spam you every 4 seconds and burst you with familiars. Also, he's a pretty fucked up laner.
@esven you don't get soul assumption level 1? almost guaranteed a first blood if you can force a rune fight. 215 magic damage with a 900 range at level 1 is pretty strong! what do you get instead? the slow?
@loveskill i think you must be confusing him with another hero ;) dunno how you could say this hero is boring. you think he is boring because you can't spam spells in the first 5mins?
^I don't know where you're getting that from. Soul Assumption is always a good spell to get, and good to max first if you want to make some carnage. If for some reason you're having a really bad time in your lane you'll get cloak, but that shouldn't happen, Visage is a very good laner.
cloak is underrated (or at least was by me) - i ate a laguna blade in my last game and it hardly scratched me :)
Cloak is not only useful for defensive purposes, it also lets you position yourself more freely to cast SA, and get charges, without caring too much about death.
He was one of the most broken heroes for a long period, so giving him any big buff is scary. He was pretty ridiculous when birds' health were changed into "4 hero hits to kill" too. Now that it's 3, he's mostly only picked by players who are actually skilled with the hero. He's not that popular in competitive right now outside of those who can play him exceptionally well.
For pubs he's never been very popular since he's both a support and requires some microing. Simpler heroes are more preferred for the average pub (which is only around 2.5K, maybe less), and especially support players, who often pick supports since they're not confident in their own skills (not true for everyone, but often the case). Or like new to the game and told to play support by their higher mmr friends.
That 4 hit bird patch was brilliant. Pretty much impossible to lose a bird :-)
One last point to those not convinced - level 4 soul assumption is equivalent to a level 1 laguna blade on a 4 sec cooldown.
He doesn't "need items and levels a lot" of course he is better with them like any hero is but he can have a great impact without lane farm and living off kill and kill assist gold.
Name a hero that doesn't need items and levels by your definition
PS that's a great account you have btw - apart from only having 3 games on visage that is of course ;)
WTF ９ＴＥｎＴａＣＬｅＳｕｒＰｒｉＳｅ～ you have less than 25% win rate with your main hero and 75+% win rate with a lot of other heroes man are you a troll or just a weird guy? haha :P
Let me guess you keep your account below 4k just to fuck with people? CHI LONG QUA must be proud of you
"needs no items and can still kill shit for 40mins."
I personally think he needs items to be effective and kill shit. Utility of birds and soul assumption spam will always be there, but to be truly useful and be 2 heroes in one, you need items.
Also, a lot of pubs are too scared of micro. Even if he rises in picks in the competitive scene, you won't see that big of a rise in pubs.
^ Are you kidding man? that makes things harder, look i like to play naga but every fucking time i pick the hero i got insta flammed by 3 shitstains in my team before the game begins saying that naga is a bad carry or they just pick other carries and try to steal lane farm / jungle (its the same as naga you cant play with a greedy jungler like LC or naix in your team) all because the hero has 45% win rate and poor pick rate too.
In low 4k mmr nobody play decently the hero (and below she doesnt ever got picked) so people undestimate her pretty much.
Chen / enchantress players will understand this cause your cancer teammates always will chose to play with the guy that pick jungle bloodseeker.
i think the actually optimal way to play visage in normal skill is to go mjollnir/ac/shadow blade probably
@havoc if you're going to put yourself through pubs you may as well pick a hero that is a challenge to distract from the madness surrounding you :)
visage needs alot of item, is basically oen fo the grediest supports out there. he is not hero to creat situation for his allys to thrive. rather his allys create situtaion for u and u deal the dmg. cant expect team to do that in low lvl pub. also no harddisable makes for sad games vs storm ember etc. also visage cant excape. u manfight and win or loose. if u loose and u had good game u will feed streakgold as a support which cant be good.
my build:
treads - wand - medallion - aghs - solar crest - sythe / AC / shiva / deso / ATOS!
only buy as many wards as necessary take space whereever u can. carry Gem for team, check highgrounds with birds ez +50 gold. semicarry gankers (slark clinkz lina qop etc) cant kill u quick due to your nice passive but over time ull die soon enough but create option for team to kill the semicarry ganker.
gl hf mirco is ez
yeee im normal skill scrub, idk why i commented.
my love for visage overwhelmed me.
@wonder i encounter the same problem of inconsiderate pickers.
i'm a hipster, i try to utilize low picked heros; so i know all about naga. she is gg but only with space.
everybody wants to carry. so im all like, "hey guys ill support!" and ks with the nuke, hehehehe.
@tripplesteal atos aghs all day; definitely guilty of the shadow blade.
that sound pretty legit man :p, i pick heroes i like, i dont care if they are out of the meta i think i havent played with lesh, storm, BS or gyro in this patch. but still im a greedy capitalist bastard who wants 800+ gpm in every match after all.
despite that im such a tryharder when i play support idk man being a meta player is boring as fuck
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Really bugs me that this hero hasn't seen more love in this patch. 2nd least picked is shameful!
About as perfect a pub support as you could get - needs no items and can still kill shit for 40mins. He also counters most of the meta heroes - blood, lesh, techies,lina, huskar are all easy meat for visage and his birdies.
Hoping for a buff in 6.85 and maybe he'll break top 100 most picked :)