General Discussion

General DiscussionVoid and mana

Void and mana in General Discussion
Dire Wolf

    I don't play void much, but I go pretty standard void build, treads, mom, maelstrom, crystalis, daedulus/mkb, mojllnir. Bkb if needed. His mana sucks now though with his ult costing so much, does it make battlefury attractive again or possibly going aghs rush? Like aghs after maelstrom, before crystalis. I seem to never have mana. You time walk and ult once and you have to go to base to recharge, it stinks. And forget using timewalk while farming or you will never have enough to tp and join a fight and ult. Not sure if battlefury would even be enough regen to make it better than malestrom + crystalis cus it's about same price as those two together.

    Korrosiv

      tread-switching helps a lot, plus help from bottles/arcane boots from your team. I've resorted a couple of times to bringing mango/s with courier when doing rosh after a tf and the enmy team buying back or something like that when you need the mana asap.

      IMO early aghs is risky, if you get a bad start you end up with no damage at all.

      casual gamer

        aquila + treads i think

        matrice

          Personnaly, as i pretty unlucky with void, i just skip backtrack. at least this way i can spam madness on cooldown to farm, without having to worry about the mana of tp + time walk + chrono.

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          TripleSteal-

            tread switching 24/7
            bf is... extremely suboptimal
            aquila is not worth purchasing imo
            aghs is underrated, its a good 4th-5th bog item. it helps u with mana pool, too.

            Dire Wolf

              I don't struggle late with mana though. By then your pool is usually fine and you're team fighting a lot more so getting a lot more mana boot hits. Early it's a struggle.

              Pom Pom 🍕

                Battlefury doesnt help on your pool, only regen. Agha is always great though since you dont have to be as conservative with your ulti either. With only mom, treads and maxed timelock in chrono you do a ton of damage for a good amount of time. So getting aghs then or after mael is just fine (unless you're too behind to get any farm). After mael is better farmwise though.

                It's especially great if you have combo heroes like wd and skywrath mage. Chrono is a teamskill too, you're not the only one who can damage the stunned chrono targets.

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                braindead
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                  iphone....wow

                    how about drum? cmiiw
                    better stats, +as and ms

                    casual gamer

                      drums is a lot of gold for not much benefit

                      youd get more mana out of a basi or wand, both of which are way cheaper

                      Totentanz to The King: M ...

                        You could try Manta Diffusal build. Both give some INT and your illusions also have feedback. It's bad for farming though.

                        Dire Wolf

                          I think I'll stick to what I've been doing and try to tread swap/conserve mana or maybe rush an aghs after maelstrom. I just wondered if there were better alternatives but it doesn't seem like it. I really don't want to go manta or drums on void.

                          Pom Pom 🍕

                            One alternative is keeping 1-2 mangoes in your inventory to use when you really need the extra burst of mana.

                            bibi

                              If your team has alot of ranged dmg like a skywrath i would go aghs third item. Tbh i wouldnt go void if you dont have alot of dmg in your team, you will just end up wasting your chrono in this patch.

                              artemis

                                Tread switching is all I need early on. The only time you really need mana on void early in the game is to TW -> Ult or to TW away. Just don't waste mana and always tread switch to int to cast your spells, then if you ult switch back to agi and start hitting.

                                Dire Wolf

                                  It's not quite that simple though. Say you tp to a lane for a solo pickoff cus void can solo a lot of supports at 6 with just mask. You kill him now you're oom. Have to go back to base now and you just tpd down it sucks. Any time you get a solo kill without the mana boots supports this is the case. Oh well it's just a balancing feature of the hero I guess

                                  bibi

                                    After you kill an hero insteas of tping out or walking back to base, make your way to the jungle instead. Profit.

                                    Ath[e]isT

                                      ^^ thats also when a battlefury regen would be really nice even tho I agree its kind of sub optimal ... its one of those items you ahve to get it really fast on void for it to be worth delaying core items like mom bkb dmg

                                      braindead
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                                        bibi

                                          This is what happens when you go BF on void you f*cks.

                                          http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1484391416

                                          braindead
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                                            Electabruce420

                                              Yeah I think he needs a slight buff, very slight, on the int gain, I even tread switch and still, use mom a few times, see a kill in another lane, tp, time walk, crono, 0 mana. The guy is just so stupid now. But really, very bad mana issues, if none on your team buys mana boots you are pretty fucked up. I think the pick got much more situational now.

                                              braindead
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                                                Dire Wolf

                                                  He's still really good, gyro being fotm kinda hurts him but at least you can counter that with a bkb. The sniper nerfs are a huge help cus if you didn't chrono sniper first you were screwed.

                                                  artemis

                                                    If you struggle with mana and nobody in your lane is going to get one, pick up an aquila. It's cheap and effective and by the time your ult is back up you probably will regen enough mana to fight or at least TW away when needed. I prefer treads into MoM & maelstrom, then start on big items depending on what I need.

                                                    You could try aquila and treads into w/e farming items you like (MoM, maelstrom, bfury). I've seen people build multiple small items quickly then start upgrading them (so you get treads, yasha, MoM, maelstrom, crit) and then one by one upgrade.

                                                    Lots of builds can work, it kind of depends on what your team needs out of him and how you play him.

                                                    Edit: Silver edge can work on him as well. Provides hp, a slow, Break, invis (so you dont waste TW getting to your target), and a hard hitting first hit, plus the target can't do much dmg until debuff wears off.

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                                                    Dire Wolf

                                                      Silver edge sounds horrible, it's only 15 less mana than time walk and it's only 100g more to get a daedulus. Sorry but it's sounds pretty stupid to build that, not to mention how freakin nuts your team would go. That'd probably be instant low priority queue.

                                                      Aquila might not be so bad, or just some mangos and wand.

                                                      artemis

                                                        It's probably more of a situational pick, but yeah I wouldn't get one just because you're right teammates would flame nonstop. Break is a very powerful debuff against certain heroes. The rest of the bonuses are meh on void, but disabling passives can be a big deal depending on the team comps.

                                                        I've never built it on void, and probably won't. There are really good void players out there that have gotten it, but that doesn't really mean it's a good pickup. The benefit of invis isn't to save mana, it is that you can get to the target, initiate, kill the target, then escape using TW. If you have to TW to ult, then you have to walk away which leaves you more open to counterganks.