dude majority of the time its the jungler whining
and technically if you pick a jungler when your team has a weak laning phase, its your obligation to gang, at least as much obligation as a support buying wards/courier
Rather same with hatsune miku. When you pick a heroes with NO lane presence
you'll go wood
-> offlane fucked even harder
-> mid fucked (without gang)
-> safe lane fucked (while it' always has been a SINGLE SUPPORT that zone offlaner
and then you have 2-4 whiner about how you should not go wood.
That's the exact same shit we had when techies went. Suddently 4 retard that almost feed on purpose. Like an offlaner diying 3 times in the first 3 min, but that's cause there's a techies in team.... yeah ofc
I hate when people go Jungle and AFK jungle for 15... It means that we have 10% chance of winning the game as lanes are not as strong and yeah.
I could write the opposite, I hate when i cann't go out of woods for 15 minutes, cause at minutes 4-5 my team is already 0-5.
There's ofc some wooder that abuse of "my team suck" but much more often, it's really the team that suck ball dieing like shit for no reason. If you went tri safe, instead of dual + wood, would that 5 first death occured? yup they would, cause you actually even have negativ impact being on the lane, as you just slowed down the lvl 3 of early-mid game heroes.
The moment a wood HAS to start to make impact, is arround minutes 7-8, cause starting by minutes ~6 the advantage he gave is shrinking, to a point, (close to 8-9 minutes) he will have negative impact compare to full laning
Well if the safelane farmer is f.e. a spectre or anti mage and the support goes for cm (or even worse a single earthshaker), a farming passive jungler will make this lane lose. A timbersaw or bristleback will screw the safelane. Ofc this does not mean, that the offlane and midlane must lose, too. But IF (and this can happen) the offlane or midlane loses, the impact of many common junglers (LC, NP) is very limited. He can't rotate and fix the issue, cause he needs farm to be effecitve. If the team has allready 1 hardcarry in the lineup a farming jungler makes it basically a 3v5 instead of a 4v5 for the first 15 min.
A team with 2 supports (best case: Roaming) will beat the Junglerteam in 90% of all cases, if they don't throw or do jackshit on the lane. This is not Lol, get over it.
It also depends on the jungler. An enigma that comes lvl 3 with 6 eidolons can do good work. Same goes for an axe that visits, or chen or ench.
For those who defend Junglers here: Why do proteams rarley go for a farming jungler, if it is so gud?
Cause it is not.
"There's ofc some wooder that abuse of "my team suck" but much more often, it's really the team that suck ball dieing like shit for no reason. If you went tri safe, instead of dual + wood, would that 5 first death occured? yup they would, cause you actually even have negativ impact being on the lane, as you just slowed down the lvl 3 of early-mid game heroes."
That's not right. If you were on the lane, no deaths would have occured as trilanes are insanely strong and it is nearly impossible to die on it, unless you are extremely bad.
9v1 pretty much nailed it.
"That's the exact same shit we had when techies went. Suddently 4 retard that almost feed on purpose. Like an offlaner diying 3 times in the first 3 min, but that's cause there's a techies in team.... yeah ofc"
That is extremely biased. Many times laning phase is lost because :
1. duo against strong offlane
2. there is no offlane hero
3. a solo support is much less likely to rotate than a duo support
Sometimes they don't even feed. The enemies just win the lanes with farm and zone your teammates out.
But rather, the point of this thread was about how junglers do not have the right to complain. You subject your teammates to a harsh laning phase because you do not want to deal with the difficulties of laning and want safe consistent farm. I don't justify them going on tilt and feeding 0-4 when it could have been a 0-0 or 0-1 lane where they managed to snatch farm and levels. I do however, say they have the right to be angry if their forced into having a tough lane because you wanted the limelight of exiting jungle the most farmed in your team.
@humdinger
idk man.. why would junglers even whine first when team is already flaming the shit out of him cause his useless the entire game...
Im pretty sure if someone wants to go jungle, he will tell the team about it beforehand, so it shouldn't be a surprise anyway.
The wood support has to make action since the begining, are they are not playing their role. No point to discuss that.
There's only the carry wood instead of lane to talk about.
In which case the carry pick on safe lane is stupid, (no point to talk about it)
while a 2nd support that scale well with early lvl item, or even what i like to call an offtank -due to mechanics of their role pretty similar to lol's one- being the "farmer" like sand king or axe would not only be enough to make a 2man lane crushing the offlaner,
but also allow the support of the lane to actually move even more freely (more lvl, can take early gold for boot, countrary to the 3lane support; and don't need to suck the dick of the farmer of the lane since he is strong enough to handle an offlaner)
The only difference is you cann't make the 2men gank squad toward middle as easily/early, as some stuff for wooding are pretty dedicated, and thus the wooder sometime cann't go on the lane before 3-4 minutes (unless supported by one of those 2 guy ^^)
I have no problem with jungle cores, but they should fucking do something in the mid game.
"But rather, the point of this thread was about how junglers do not have the right to complain."
Who are you to dictate people's rights LMAO. People do what they want no matter what you think about it, so how about you stop whining and making pointless threads and s tfu and play your own game.
That explains why some players having 49% overall winrate with 2k games of experience and still stuck in normal skill bracket.
Those shitty attitude. Typical p*noy.
i remember going terrorblade woods, mid and offlane went like 0 - 3 both in 5 minutes.
"gg wp, please report terroblade"
mmmmmmmkay.
when theres a jungler, the laning phase really become 4v5.
Not hard to tell which team is more likely going to lose the laning phase.
Even in the pro scene, when they run a jungler like engima. They are often given the term "greedy" pick
So they other lanes are usually self supporting. Eg, tidehunter
For example of a team that is NOT self supporting:
AM safe lane + single support, any hero without an escape/tankiness eg. slark offlane
If your team has an antimage and slark, and u pick a jungler. Unless your enemy is total shit. You are going to have a bad time.
Then again with the new runes, i seldom see any junglers other than np these days. Nps are special cus they can support any lane when they need it (assuming he knows how to save his tp cd+get early game presence items)
I am not unfamiliar getting a doom on my team who jungles for 25 min to get radiance vs a Void and he dies within 2 sek in chrono.
GJ I said, 100 dmg each is still more than you did for the past 25 min.
Melbola in normal bracket with 110 Broodmother games and 19.09% % and kda of 5.54 says
"Dude, that's why I mute my whole team at the beginning of each and every game"
could not stop laughing
Exp matters more than farm in the early game, so if you don't feed the enemy team the team with the jungler should have an early game advantage.
It's more complicated than that, as you have to factor in the heroes on each team and people can get zoned out of exp range and whatnot, but when someone picks a jungler you should pick a hero that is hard to zone out, right?
If you have a support like skywrath, you can zone the offlaner unless you are dualling with a useless lane hero such as spectre
I hate when they have an easy-to-shutdown hero like Spectre or Terrorblade, and they decide to choose a jungler anyway.
when someone picks jungle hero in beggining and you know that someone will stay solo, it can be ok.
last-pick jungler where in your team no hero for hardlining- that pisses me off.
And yes, i had many games lost when dude was planning to stay 30-40 minutes in forest, not defending any tower or participating in any teamfight before that timemark.
I suppose they win games when team just wins without them, but what sense to come out of forest just to push ancient?
They tend to whine about "ff noob team"
Good player will help his team especially if it is loosing.
there's actually a quite easy fix to jungling in pubs. just make it that if you are not on lane you don't get any time gold whatsoever.
simple yet brilliant. no need to thank me.
i mean if ur offlane is feeding out of control or something thats entirely the offlaners fault, if ur mid is same deal. if its a problem with not being able to zone the offlaner thats different
the only thing that could suck is if you get aggro tri'd on but even then the jungler should be able to win you that lane after 3-4 minutes.
if you have someone who wants to pick a jungler, make sure to pick a strong zoning/dual laning hero (lich, AA, sky, jakiro) so you can minimize the amount of farm the offlaner gains from being in a 1v2 instead of 1v3, then you have your trade off with a shit ton of xp/gold in the jungle. meaning, its ur fault if someone picks a jungler and you pick cm, then find out the enemy offlane zones you and your support out completely. its the main reason i hate people who pick cm.
tl;dr afk junglers are autists, ppl that fail to realize the trade off if they're the ones in lane are autists
Jungle is fine, just don't last pick it or pick it when you need a dual offlane to shutdown their carry. It's no better or worse than people last picking a second hard carry who needs babysitting when you already have one. Like picking anti mage as your 5th hero when you already have spectre.
just let ur team u gonna jungle so ur pick dsnt make cristal maden or some hero like that to offlane
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its ridiculous
its almost as ridiculous as feeders saying their team plays bad