General DiscussionKunkka matchups .

I play Zeus a lot, and Kunkka destroys Zeus (needs defensive Eul's ASAP).
I guess worst matchup is MK.

Timber and tiny crush kunkka. He seems rather solid in traditional mid matchups

Timber, Mk, and to some degree Od /viper are bad matchups. Can manage most other imo.

only sf and viper is "hard" matchup rest are easy as fuck

Sf and viper aren’t too bad. Timber and mk are ur biggest enemies.

Also nice little tip, use ur w on the ranged creep on the first wave to damage the other mid as fast as possible. The ranged creep won’t be in deny range and ur tidebringer should be back up during the first wave

Check !Attacker's videos for the buildups (except when he is trolling with dagon EB). He always adapts his build to the drafts, buildups and situation.

His combos execution and aggro management for tidebringer are godlike as well.

kunka honestly too easy to play 1 torrent auto stacks the side camp near mid and then you cleave it down around 9 mins for a jungle item and around 4.5k to 5k networth

Vaikiss`742. lol "rest are easy as fuck"
Yea I guess MK or Huskar are getting crushed by Kunnka lmao

Alright im getting the general idea . But the thing is my pet hero is alche , and hes countered by mk , tiny , timber and viper also . So Any suggestion on hero that is good against THOSE heroes that my kit becomes complete if im countered .

Necro is pretty good vs Most of them.

Very interesting , as my necro is also solid and I like that hero .

How about troll , lesh , husky , razor , qop , wr ,batrider , pugna or even like lone druid ? I have a feeling they are either good or okay against tiny , mk , timber and viper . Or am i wrong ?

@reha prettysure kunkka has no problems with huskar atleast until hes 6 after that might be different story

mk is just retarded hero so no melee hero can lane against him cuz hes "melee" but ranged

Nvm just got a tiny mid against me and took necro and ABSOLUTELY demolished that guy .

^Tiny is considered as roaming and not even midlane lmfao : https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/5217073736
He must have had A LOT OF FUN against your necro.

How about troll , lesh , husky , razor , qop , wr ,batrider , pugna or even like lone druid ? I have a feeling they are either good or okay against tiny , mk , timber and viper . Or am i wrong ?

^HAHAHAH just saw that now tiny roaming xD . He literally couldnt even stand near the creeps as after 3 min mark he just stood and watched when i denied creeps after that he went top to roam .

You want a 2x2 table to analyze the matchups ? xD

Nah omegalul . I just want something like { troll is very weak against them , lesh is squishy , husky is good , batrider is imba good etc blah blah } Im generally good at considering matchups but I havent played a lot of unconventional mids u see .

The only mid that really fucking wrecks a kunkka is a realy good invoker, a really good huskar, a timbersaw to some regard, a monkey king to some regard, and finally, an alchemist who doesn't bothers contesting and just wave clears mid and farms his neutrals.

Also some combos or niche skill or item builds .

There was a time where Veils was so fucking good that by level 7 you were an absolute powerhouse.
Currently Boat got a little nerfed and Veils so much worse so you can't really deviate and go magic build so much.
Aghs is still broken as tits so you really want to go 75% of the games for that unless there's like 3 bkbs on the other team

^^ Thats some really good shit .

you people are fucking retarded if you think timbersaw and mk are hard for kunkka LMAO, all either low ranks or people who smurf/abuse and have shit experience

against timbersaw, it comes down to creep skipping and pulling. its unlikely you come out of the lane ahead of him but the goal here is simply to minimize the networth difference because unless timbersaw counters your entire team, kunkka has great catch and magic damage to deal with timbersaw in a gank and is a good vessel carrier. you only lose this lane if you lack brain cells and dont know to adapt. like being a retard and trying to harass him whilst taking more damage than him. this is like a 60-40 matchup in timber's favor, it's absolutely possible to win as kunkka if you know what you're doing (and your team does).

against monkey king, it comes down to wave manipulation. the lifesteal from jingu is shit at the lower levels. as long as you know how to pull aggro and shove the wave, theres nothing much monkey can do to you. the goal is to see-saw the lane between the two mid towers so its either pushing into your tower or his. this combined with the occasional tidebringer harass makes mk the one who is suffering cuz of a regen war. once 6 comes, any gank means an almost guranteed kill on mk. keep in mind to use torrent first in the combo so he can't dodge boat damage. you only lose this lane if you're a retard who has no brain cells and lets the lane lock the middle while MK zones you out. kunkka also scales a lot better than a non-snowballing monkey king. this lane is actually favored to kunkka 65-35ish. Kunkka wins the lane easy and wins midgame.

can all you players who dont know what you're talking about stop giving bad advice tq

Viper and OD are the true menace in a high level game.

Some people probably wondering, if kunkka can deal with timber/mk/huskar/etc, why not Viper? Because against all these other heroes, Kunkka can still lane properly, especially at the start. Viper can zone you out with kill potential the moment the first wave meets. He can actually deny everything to the point where you're so underlevelled you can't get a foothold to work with. you cant clear camps, you cant cut the wave, you can't approach the lane to even tide bringer to seesaw the lane. however, add some early game rotations and you're good to go in recovery mode and you scale better. i rate this super difficult because you absolutely can't do anything at all against viper without team help and if the viper knows what he's doing

OD, a lot of kunkka 'counters' don't scale very well which is why they're not commonly picked. Timbersaw/mk/huskar/razor and etc, they're all on a timer. not OD. OD lanes well against kunkka, and astral is a strong save for both your allies and yourself at all stages of the game against kunkka. you also scale better. so it means you win early mid late game.

^ Then my brother , back to my second question , to complete my kit , which hero should i master to be able to counter the "kunkka counters" .

You mean what heroes you should practice to counter Kunkka counters...?

I don't really think it works that way. For example, you can't learn how to win a MK mid with another hero and expect that experience to transfer over. Every hero deals with other heroes in their own way.

So you either just spam Kunkka (duh) and learn how to deal with these counters through reflection, or you play the counters yourself to better understand what they're trying to achieve against Kunkka and you work backwards from there. For example, MK would like to jam the wave and zone you away without the creeps pushing. Work backwards and it means your goal is to fuck with the equilibrium, you can block, use torrent/tidebringer, pull aggro, etc.

I think u didnt understand the question . Lets ""suppose"" that arc warden counters my alchemist hard . Sometimes i just dont want to play against that arcwarden counter so instead if i have the last pick i get brood . Similarly i want list of heroes that counter OD or viper . Cuz they are indeed bullshit braindead heroes u dont always want to play against .

all either low ranks or people who smurf/abuse and have shit experience

Im a big fan of dk and gonna suggest it here. Buy asoul ring spam breathe fire and u will control the creepwaves. U max dragons blood however and get armor and regen enpugh to survive the tidebringer