"Before watching" opinion: their line-up sucked hard whilst your was good.
"Before watching" opinion #2: don't run lion as a position 5 support. He needs levels + some mobility item for him to truly shine.
Unless you can ensure that enemy won't make an agressive tri, so lion can make some fast pulls and get that level. But looking at this draft, they could and probably did an offensive tri.
The first thing that jumps out is Lion really struggled. Faust is not best at Lion. He has 1.44 KDA, and 4-7 win-loss for Lion.
It looks like he would do lot better with VS. He has 2.42 KDA and 10-3 win-loss for VS. Try to pick heroes your team is good at using.
If you want a more defensive support he does pretty well on dazzle. 2.84 KDA and 8-4 win-loss. (after watching...your kunkka is very bad at kunkka too, find a different hero for him. I can't suggest one since he has stats off.)
Mindhackers 2 are tryharding right from the start, with a smoke from fountain to ward and 5 man gank your jungle.
They really should have put invoker mid instead of Tide. But the fact that they do means they want to teamfight early...really want that ravage badly. DS should win against Necro and he does. Kunkka vs Tide lane should be fairly even, but your Kunkka outplays him. This tide probably does not play mid much so he just passively accepts that its Kunkka's lane.
Kunkka's gank on bot at 4:10 with that haste...right idea, bad execution. Kunkka should have removed cold feet by running past them and hitting AA or viper instead of juking back and getting frozen...that is why Lion dies so fast and AM should not have died at all. Kunkka could have done 7 attacks during the period from 4:03 to 4:14 and got in 3 tidebringers...but instead he did 1 atttack and 1 tidebringer and spent the rest of the time walking around. At least he cleans it up nicely afterward.
AM screws himself by walking into icewall before blinking past it, then walking back past the enemy heroes instead of into the easy safety of the trees next to him.
Anyway overall, your lanes seem fine...should work better than their lanes since they put invoker bot and Tide mid.
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OK, now the tri-lane...you have AM, Rubic, Lion defensive vs Invoker, AA, Viper aggressive. You have two hard stuns at level 1, they have none. You should be trying to fight them. It looks like you were intimidated by that FB and hang back.
They have 3 range heroes and you have 2. You won't win harass battles. You want to engage and go for kills. Someone needs to understand this quickly and make the call to fight. To fight them 3 v 3 in the lane you need to time it right. That means. do it when your creeps are alive and theirs are dead. You can most effectively achieve this by attacking creeps on that first wave to get them low faster. They will be happy that you are doing this, think you will push out the lane...but the moment their last creep is about to die, grab one with telekinesis and throw them into your creeps...then Lion stuns and you move in for the kill. You will probably trade kills but that's fine. You are a defensive tri-lane. You have the tower. You have the pulls. You have options to retreat. They have no options. They must win every trade or they are screwed.
But if you don't have the confidence for this...ok, wait for mid to come help and that is what you did. But really, your lane is stronger. You should have attacked right away. Maybe you knew this...you grab Invoker at 1:56, but you did not prep the lane by attacking creeps so it will not work. The new wave is already arriving. You needed to kill your creeps faster and attack at more like 1:45.
2:16 you grab invoker again, better timing...Lion is afraid or something, hiding instead of chaining the stun. I think this goes back to Faust being uncomfortable with the hero. He is used to losing when he plays Lion, so he will hesitate to fight and be unsure of his moves.
3:40 enemy doesn't understand their combo either...should begin with viper slow then cold snap, then cold feet...but their positioning is not good enough to execute it.
4:32 picked up boots (smart for tri-lane fights) Buy more obs also, start that cd ticking. You are very low, might want a tp, if you die you can come back to the lane quickly and keep fighting.
4:50 salve up and ...magic stick, also good tri-lane vs tri-lane choice. You shopped to long, missed the start of the next fight. Kunkka caught also because he was shopping instead of watching the lane. Kunkka panics and cast boat too late and badly, he retreats way too far before casting. Could have killed all 3 of them if he got it right.
6 min stack does not work because its blocked. This also means they see you do it and know you are not near allies. 6 min your vision is all gone and new wards are still on the chick. In higher level play you need to get those out to yourself so you can place as or before wards expire. Because they are not up yet you do not see the rotation of tide to the bot lane.
6:41 AA is clumsy and gives away their aggressive position before they are ready to attack. GJ avoiding the gank and pinging it.
7:30 well played teamfight.
7:56 ward vision back up. Now remember that pull was blocked. You need to deward to control the lane and protect AM's farm.
8:43 ward vision spots Tide rotating bot again, gj on the ping.
10:31 attack on Invoker fails because it was the wrong time. Dire creep wave is nearly all there. They are right by their tower...wrong time to attack. At this time you should have been pulling creeps to move the lane back so AM can farm. Also when you take a skill from invoker you have to check to see how high level it is. Invoker had the absolute weakest tornado possible..if you knew that you would have not bothered casting and tried to get something else.
11:35 Got sniped...staying around while low is very bad against globals. You were going to salve up, but you walked forward and revealed yourself before doing it. Try to stay in fog...honestly though AA just happened to be pre-casting that for them to attack the lane. Still if you had stayed back it would not have hit you untill after salving.
12:35 that really was a fail boat. Have your kunka wait for a set up stun. Prediction is hard. Have him get some points in X instead of maxing torrents he can't hit anyway.
13:40 very nice play. Stole ravage, returned, got full combo done, multi-hero stun on tk, salved up..just beautiful
But there is a problem! Ward vision is down. You stay in the lane for another full minute on half hp and mp with no regen instead of going back to heal and replacing the wards...stacking a camp as you go. Because of standing around Dire regains the initiative and kicks your butt on the next fight.
15:48 wasting tp to bot ...nothing is happening there. Walk out so you can tp to another lane when it matters. Also, no obs! You need to protect AM farm with obs vision. You have the gold, you have the inventory slots, obs are off cd...get that vision up!
18:00...remember every rune is an opportunity. When 2 min clicks I should see you looking at the spawn point. I never do. If you want to know where that opportunity is and what it is you will get into the habit of at least looking and whenever possible already being there to take it right when it spawns or guard it for someone else.
18:18 panicking instead of casting. You needed to toss tide immediately back to stun them and stop their advance. Also get Fade bolt cast right away. Kunkka takes 12 right clicks after you should have already cast it and before you actually cast it. That is 384 more dmg to him because you were late. He would have easily lived.
19:30 You have Arcanes...wards still not up. AM needs to be protected to farm the jungle.
20 min rune spawns, you don't check. 20:22 wards arrive, but it has taken so long they are already in your jungle and DS dies.
At this point the wards are actually about 6 minutes late. Dire was very slow to take advantage of the gap.
21:29 terrible decision for kunkka to tp in to T2 instead of T3. If Lion was fast he might have saved it but its unlikely and he is slow anyway. You played this about as well as possible. DS saves the day big time.
22 min...farming instead of placing the wards, bad.
24 min amazing rune luck, but because you were there you capitalize.
I don't like Euls on Rubic...really Euls has sucked every since they nerfed it so you can't use it defensively on allies. Get Fstaff. Or if you really want that super high mana regen, Soul Ring is more effective mp/s, and 3 hp/sec and costs 1100 gold less. I will count the number of times you use Euls to actually accomplish something.
29:46 you run away from nothing but the fireworks hitting your allies and not you. Try not to panic. First use of euls saves Invoker from about 500 dmg and from telekinesis landing on him. 29:50 you juke away from nothing a 2nd time so you do 2 less attacks than you could have. 29:56 you run from nothing a 3rd time instead of killing off Viper. Viper lives on 13 hp and gets two more attacks on your AM, doing another 200 dmg. AM dies just before his blink is off cd.
32 min, strategic error. AM should be farming the jungle or pushing bot. Don't have him stand around with you waiting for a teamfight. When Kunkka randomly fails boat for no reason. That is the time for the team to back up. Team does back up 15 sec later...ok, late but right choice.
33 min stack the ancients, take the small camp...good support tactics.
34:14 another bad use of Euls gives Tide the option to blink away and his team an extra 2.5 second to decide what to do about your initiation. You know what would make it easy to get in and take things like ravage or reapers scythe? Force Staff. Necro uses tp to do what it is most used for...feed. So you get Scythe anyway.
After this fight again...no wards on the map. It is best to have the new wards ready, in inventory before the old ones expire. Because you have no vision Dire retakes the initiative. You lose 6 heroes for 2 including DS bb to die a 2nd time.
First ward finally up at 39:40 after no vision at all for 4 min.
41:32 3rd use of Euls dodges EMP, gj.
41:45 almost stole Ravage, but got disabled mid combo...teamwipe, lost T2, T3 and top raxed. Everyone on your team failed execution this fight and so 5 to zero team wipe.
Dire decides to stand around in your base like morons until you all respawn so they lose 4 heroes for nothing giving you another chance to win.
44:41 Fstaff can save DS, but its on cd because you used it to get AM out of trees when he has a 4 sec blink cd. AM uses that blink you saved to overextend. This fight was very bad, but at least you stole ravage because tide wanted to use his shiny new refresher instead of thinking.
46 min Dire take roshan, what you really need here is...yes! ward vision of the incoming attack...but no wards are up again. So you are blind. You had about 90 seconds to do it and hit creeps instead.
46:50...great initiation Fstaff ravage...but then for some reason you never want to use fade bolt or steal a new spell. Hundreds of extra dmg hits your team because you won't use fade bolt right away. Then for some reason you decide to protect tide for 2.5 seconds with that Euls while his low cd spells are recharged. Also you back out 500 units running from nothing instead of doing things like casting fade bolt, attacking, or stealing a new spell.
49:25, bad use of ravage. when telekinesis was enough and you needed ravage for the main fight. Good use of Euls however to slow down Necro making him easy to kill.
50:20 saved yourself with Euls, now 3-3 on Euls usages.
AM and Kunkka have reached that point where it is very hard for them to lose...Invoker tries some combos but he is no Grimorum. Just spamming a lot of spells really doesn't matter. They have to be the right ones at the right times in the right places.
56:35 you choose to save Invoker from your DB...Euls 3-4. Great idea to initiate on the flank though. Another nice Ravage steal too died to forgetting magic wand use.
Good use of wards and gem on the final push. 60 min, smart attacking Invoker first, good use of Euls to save yourself. Euls ends 4-4. Maybe if you could refrain from using it on enemy heroes it would be ok. Overall a solid game of Rubic, except your warding sucked most of the game.
Can you make a analysis about this game too, relentless? http://dotabuff.com/matches/336732889
Would've been very appreciated
Often when you have 75.44% win and 4.77 KDA on one hero...and 0% win and 1.18 KDA on the other you get very distorted perspective on who should win a lane. Don't worry about it.
what does that even mean? ive watched the replay, the necro is just terrible.
im not a ds player, but ive played vs ds my whole life and i actually now that there is no way for a ds to win a necro on lane 1v1.
idk how u can even refer to such stats when i have 1game with ds. imagine it was just a bad game, i could be best ds@world actually.
If ur so sure about ur perspective we can give it a try right now?
also u have terrible stats with both of them so how can u be so confident about ur perspective ?
idk im starting to think that i missunderstood you
No, I'm sorry. I am not a child. Also as anyone who reads dotabuff knows I have terrible lag and have not been able to play a decent game of dota for 2 weeks.
Necro can stay in the lane and protect the tower...but DS can easily backlane and take neutral creeps besides. It's very easy for DS to win the lane in the sense of getting more gold and experience. And that is what happened in this game too. DS has a decisve advantage. And while DS can kill a lower skill Necro who runs out of mana...DS would really have to feed badly to die to Necro...there is no need to even get close unless DS gets greedy and tries to dive for a kill.
yeah well this is total bullshit, when u play 1v1 ds u get sentries and block the camp, while he obviously dont get the sentries since his team will get it for safelane.
so now how could he win the lane in a 1v1matchup without the neutrals advantage ?
+necro is all about being in control, u wont ever be oom if u manage it good... .
anyway its meanless to talk about stuff like this, the only way to prove my point is to play, so do u wanna try it out ?
why are u talkin about being a child? i dont wanna 1v1 u so i can screenshot and post it everywhere on the forum, i just wanna proove u my point. i actually wont care if i win or lose, both are good to me its more about doing an experience. but if u lagg nevermind :)
No, playing a 1v1 game would be silly and meaningless like every 1v1 game.
Blocking your own neutrals is nice touch...but that does not win the lane for Necro, it only makes it a bit more even and only until the sentries run out. It won't really change much because DS doesn't have the mana to farm both the lane and nuetrals until later. Also thats 200 gold so now necro has to out cs DS by 9 creeps to come even.
go relentless, just creepskip and dont show up until u get 4x more cs then him. then mb he understands why necro dont win ds in pro games, i watched em few
?? who said necro will buy ssentries ? im talkin about a real situation match, ur supports get the sentries for you obviously -_-
4x more cs, sure u better start with 4salve then.
^I love necrolyte .... but i am pretty sure that ds can easily win a lane against necro. Sadist regen is only good after 2 or 3 levels on it. Death pulse is very mana expensive so you need the regen from sadist. Necrolyte base damage is very low and ds base damage is way higher.
@qsudfhqozkdsq You are only saying that necro can win the lane without any arguments. And plus 1 vs 1 mean NOTHING because there will be always a better player on one of the both heroes. The only way to check this kind of thing is a 1 vs 1 on players of the EXACT same level and skill.
Its pretty ridiculous the fact that you are defending a hero only because you play it ... i love necro too but i know what he can and what he cant do .... if you win agaisnt a Ds on lane is only because you are better than him ... but probably he should win that lane.
"anyway its meanless to talk about stuff like this, the only way to prove my point is to play, so do u wanna try it out ?"
Probably because you cant argument. Gl getting last hits with 45 - 49 against 60 - 66. Necro needs levels while dark seer will be better lvl 1 to lvl 4 at least.
A pro necro would do pretty well...but its really extremely difficult to lane against a pro DS. I'm fairly certain DS would win every time but not by a factor of 4. 2x cs would be the most I would expect with equally skilled players...most likely the DS would have maybe 50% more cs.
If necro gets pooled regen and sentries to block the camp...and gets a stout shield...he wont be totally run-over by back laning.
well i dont give arguments because theorcying in dota is complete bullshit and im tired but ill give u what u want.
so u start with ring protecxt 6tango 1salve branches,
u go on lane , if ds go yolo on the wave before it comes to my twr i get my q , atack him ; heal+deal with my shit, then hes alrdy low hp because he's getting hitted by me+full wave even with stout shield he'll have to b.
2nd situation, he go on lane and do the basic ion shield/hide, u get aura, u get every single lh/deny, he has to stay in range of aura or he wont get xp- then u just basically won the 1v11 at second wave u got basi, he cant push ur creeps even with double ions cuz hes lvl 2.
lvl 3 u have qlvl 2 +1aura, he start to get bored because he cant lh; he has no gold for sr;, hes oom, he bring clarities, etc, he still cant lh a creep;
lvl 4 u got boots sadist, he got nothing.
he gets pissed and try to be aggressive when he alrdy lost, u hold +atack and make him afk twr.++
stituation 3 : he stay in a 600-900range circle of the creepwaves, and ion his creep, u hit him/aggro the ioned wave on u, making the ioned creeps walking to you, while ur wave attack it + the ioned creeps get blocked by their own allies creeps most of the time its a wasted ion shield if u do that constentently = he cant push lane
etc.
now please stop act like u fuckin know everything about me watching my profile.
im an objective guy, i have played 8fuckin years of dota 1, ive played every hs ihl on d1, and got full knowledge of dota.
in a real pro match it would be harder because both players have overall control of the lane so it would be evener but there is like 10 players who master everything about DS, rest cant do shit vs necro.
again if you wanna try it out, im here.
theorycing is useless, its like sayin u have enigma tide puck magnus = autowin because enigma just go dag and ulti and then tide go ulti and then puck gogog silence ulti, its meanless cuz nothing willl happend like that in a real situation game oke?
anyway im tired of this shit, if ur so fuckin sure about that u know where to find me.
+
http://dotabuff.com/players/52567729/matches?hero=necrolyte&game_mode=&match_type=real
u obviously dont know shit about ur hero, no offense
Um Burning can't get every lasthit and deny as Anti-mage with a qblade against ion shell spam...I've seen him try to do it several times. There is no way you can do it on Necro.
How do you magically pick up RoB at wave 2? You can't even use sadist yet...Ion shell will push the wave in. You will take your full hp and more in dmg if you try to walk past it to get the sobi mask....or did your supports now give you sentries, extra regen, and immediately crow so you can get a 3rd advantage ?
waht the fuck how could u compare an am to a necro ? oh my god are u drunk or u just fell in some distorted reality just to not admit that ur not right?
an am cant lane a ds obviously because ion rapes him hard, he has 0sustains and have to face the ion to get his cs.
anyway im not gonna argue with u anymore, if u wanna prove ur point u know where i am.
Yes I do know where you are...sitting behind a computer somewhere trying to theory-craft and demanding 1 v 1 s because you don't actually have an argument beyond the fact that you are personally very good at necro.
Its incredible how you are trying to match a high level necrolyte against a completely idiot Ds .... you made 0 sense man .... its just ...
Ds is way more tanky .... has way more base damage ..... way more armor... How ds cant last hit against necro ? because of a aura that does regular to low harass ? because of necro death pulse who does regular damage and cost a good amount of mana ? Necro base damage is just so low at low levels .... sadist regen only gets good at level 2 or 3......
When thinking in 1 vs 1 dont think about you personal experience because like i say a lot you are probably better than the enemy so that really doesnt prove anything .
Sorry but how old are you ? ....
You really seem like the kind of person who you just cant talk with and its pretty hard to figure out what you are trying to say so i guess we should leave this here.
i just gave u a full a to z arguments bro, now either u come 1v1 and show me how good ur dota knowledge is either u shut the fuck up ok?
No, you said that you would get pooled 500 gold worth of extra stuff supports do not normally give a safelane solo player (sentries, regen, and crow) and then last hit and deny every creep during ion shell spam and not get sadist until level 4.
Why not just go ahead and say you will have a tri-lane to zone DS out so he can't level?
Or why not...to be fair, let the DS start with 500 extra gold too so he gets soul-ring and regen, and his own sentries to deward you and easily farm the jungle and the lane both while you try to magically deny and lasthit every creep against ion shell spam?
pooled ? idk what u think ive said, i guess its ur reality distortion that is talking, all ive said is u get the sentries from the support, like in every game.
You are changing the subject/exagerating what ive said because u feel agressed and cant counter-argue, because deep inside you understood that u'r talking was complete out of sense.
You have no life, all ur existence is about this forum, i get that, but i wont say ur right just so u can feel good with yourself when ur obviously not right.
I can help you leaving that vicious circle, all u have to do is admit that your reality is not global truth, when u'll deal with yourself, and find peace u'll see everything's gonna be better in your life.
Atm u got some sheeps that thinks ur judgement in dotaworld is good and This is your main problem, because of them you think that your judgement is good and cant see past it, but sooner or later u'll realise that this is illusionary and u'll leave ur bubble.
I really hope u'll find ur way out son, cu.
;DDD !!!xDD$$$^^^$^dsfhfdsifh
...
(: :) (:((
I'm still wondering how you get RoB on the second wave without pulling and perfect CS.
Heart Stopper Aura at level 1 is easily ignored if you aren't taking direct harass from Necro or creeps.
I don't see a DS player(a talented one) getting pissed and assuming he lost the lane at level 3-4, he doesn't need LS because the shell will provide those as well.
A proper 1v1 wouldn't allow neutral creeps or runes, so it's all about who can bottle crow the best and all that is when DS vs Necro is Necro waiting to get higher in level so he scales better and even then DS would have no problem with escaping.
You're comparing a Pro tier support with an average carry. I can't even think of the last time Necro was taken as a serious pick in any pro match ever.
What I do know is that Necro's lane presence is less than stellar and any intelligent team would never leave him alone in a lane. If I ever see a solo lane Necro, ganks would be coming until your team came to bail you out.
meh i was waiting for relentless reaction not a rdm sheep =(
why do you even take place in our conversation ?_?
yeah dunning we werent talking about that, it all started with the yoshi's game and relentless ( trololo ds won the lane like he should cuz ds is so strong vs necro lolol).
so i was like hey no, ur a fuckin moron blabla, necro should have won that lane izi and then he assumed that i had distortionned perspective issue =(
so i cried a little and then tried to explain him that hes actually not as smart as he thinks.
but he took it bad and fell in a loophole or w:e its called.
because i dont like fags that write walls of text without summary for people with adhd
yea well i dont like ppl with homeless avatar/opinions but do i complain?
I 'm sorry that you are upset that you are bad at arguing. You may think that using insults helps...but it really doesn't. But if you want to go further off the topic...maybe you could explain what you think you will get from arguing online with some guy who named himself "relentless"?
Of course you can edit it if you choose but you said you would start with "ring protecxt 6tango 1salve branches," and the sentries and would get RoB by the 2nd creep wave...so I guess you must have a flying courier delivering it because you can't walk to the shop against ion shell spam and not die. That is about 400-500 gold more than starting gold that someone is spending to help you depending on how many branches you meant. I'm not counting the first 150 for the courier since that is to be expected.
I'm sorry if you are not enjoying this like I do. You can stop whenever you want, I don't want to make you feel trapped. It just amuses me when people less than half my age call me "son" and I love to at least reach the point in the internet argument when that occurs. I hope you continue to play an excellent Necrolyte in the future. There are not very many of them and its nice to see someone doing so well with the hero.
There is a reason Necro isn't picked as often and that's because he isn't that great in lane early game, DS would win that solo lane unless Necro is a far superior player and the DS is a complete fool.
You need to spend more time formulating coherent sentences and less time trying to insult people, go back and read some of the "paragraphs" you wrote, some of those are near unreadable which is a big reason why you're being personally attacked by other members of this community in this topic and others.
its impossible to walk to the secret shop or u'll die ". x') made my day
also i actually stopped arguing 4posts ago when i realised that u'll keep thinking that ur right no matter what.
rest was only for fun, i was bored and tried to get a reaction other than '"im right blabla :(
nothing personal bro, im a cool guy i dont think ur a moron it was just for the show !!!
@dunning dude ur out of topic ? we are not debating about if necro is good or bad in the meta, ppl picked necro vs ds in yoshi's game.
ik i wasnt probably clear in my paragraphs, as i said i was tired and didnt want to wirte shit but some autist up above forced me to do it because his point was if i dont give arguments = im bad or
nvm too tired for this shit cu
DS is bad against Necro
If Necro was good against DS you'd see him more.
There is nothing more on topic than what I said.
Saying I'm off topic when all you do is throw insults while jumping around randomly in your arguments is an oxymoron.
Congrats qsudfhqozkdsq .... you represent the SHIT that internet is now a day ....You are going to need luck in life with that terrible atitude.
There is no way that you can prove yourself right now that you made yourself look like a idiot.
You are contradicting yourself over and over again and the only thing you can do now is ramdonly insulting because you know everyone here thinks you are wrong.
Somehow you transformed a simple conversation about a hero in something personal and i see you are actually hurt about this ....
Try to take it easy .... and next time you are going to argue with someone dont write like a kid.
actually i dont reprensent the SHIT that internet is nowadays, i dont give a fuck about ur opinions that's all, my life is pretty awesome, i actually know who i am and your shitty talks wont make any difference, even if there were 2000 sheeps like you agaisnt me it wont matter because your just a sheep, you know what i mean?
so there is no need to congrats me, and english is not my main language that's why i dont like arguing because i cant articulate my ideas really well.
Also dont fuckin dare telling me what to do okei little bro x')?
Nobody is mad here, ik its top1 argument of human-sheeps without any repartee but u guys should try something new sometimes.
Also u represent the SHIT that real live is nowadays, did u ever consider that ?
smart of you to take the moral high ground granting you 25% evasion
it's not like anyone here has any clue what they're talking about, let alone making sense
why would u feel sad for me ? do we know each other ? :D
buddy? srsly ?
nice vid btw.
@qsudfhqozkdsq how many games have you played Necro against DS? I see a single game in your last 15.
Relentless (as also the others)
Thanks for putting in the effort at reviewing so deeply the match. I really appreciated every bit and i see also more clearly what i should do in the upcoming matches.
Also, I'm playing with a group of friends and as you noticed some of them most of the times are really bad, but ofc there's a lot of room for improving for me too.
The replay tool is such a good feature in this game
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Hello guys,
i am looking for some good and constructing feedback about my team match of yesterday.
the match is this: http://dotabuff.com/matches/332003273
i was Rubick, as most of my matches, any good feedback would be strongly appreciated, if you feel like going into details, feel free
Thanks a lot!