sacrificing urself to save people who are already behind is probably a really bad play, you already know they suck. attending the fight and not dying so u help and get xp/gold is smart, throwing urself at them so ur 1/4 sf can crawl away and go back to farming his 20 minute euls is dumb
but sometimes ur best off just getting the wave and convincing ur team to let the tower go, or letting 2 people die instead of trying to help them and now 4 people die because of chain feeding
I think what you just said was spoken like a core or feed player terraria.
He s asking from.a support perspective and generally if they are behind because you guys have had a bad game as a team and you don't think they are retarded it's best to probably try to save them a core with proper farm will usually have more impact then a support with farm in the late game.
But.ofc if you've deemed your team.to be idiots by all means get that farm
I have ok success in my bracket being as greedy as possible without sacrificing anything
A smoke play to.catch out a core farming is great if you feel you have the burst to kill.him quickly it's usually a poor plan to seek out a 5v5 engagement in that situation.
If you do get the core you have to try and turn that into an objective to. Gain map control otherwise it was a waste
A: It depends on how early you can join the fight. If the fight is ramping up and you can throw some high impact skills in there even after your TP finished, then go for it. If you would only serve your body on a plate because the rest of the team has already died then farm the wave instead. It also depends on the hero you play. A level 5 Dazzle has a lot more impact than a level 5 Warlock.
B: In 90% of the games being active is the better choice. Get smokes, get pickoffs, regain map control! Sitting in the base is only advisable if you have excellent high ground defenders (Sniper, Dusa, Tinker), good 5 on 5 team fight and a better late game.
Dont hear any advice that come from someone who has 75-100% core picker, they cant give you any hint.
You should watch pro or high rank player playing support actually than asking here.
I think if you are playing from behind there's pretty much nothing you can do as a pos 5, if you cannot dictate what your teammates/cores are doing. You can only suggest what to do but it's pretty much pointless in an u coordinated environment. Just stick to the guy With the most farm and hope for the best
depends what kind of support you play and how the game goes on
in any case, if your carry or mid looses more than just his life when he dies like a sf or any bloodstone carry, i will go and try to save him.
lets say i play shaker or bara and im close to my blink, my bkb or whatever i think i need in that game asap, i will go farm the wave. lategame you will not do that anymore.
position 5 players will probably more likely go die for the carry. even just blinking in, throwing a stun and feeding yourself to the enemy saves your carry in many situations. all it takes is a second of distracion.
No hijack intended here but I also have a question about supporting in difficult situation:
In a recent party game I was playing p5 Shadow Shaman, my core was Ursa and my p4 was Rubick.
We were facing a duel lane of OD and Ogre and Rubick was helping our mid out mostly / roaming. I couldn't zone an OD Ogre combo and Ursa was getting pretty mad that I wasn't helping him more in lane. Gank potential was very low due to Astral Imprisonment and Ogre stun.
I was pulling, stacking and controlling bounty runes when I could as I felt I was only sapping exp or even potentially feeding if I sit in the lane constantly. Rubick couldn't come over as our mid was being dumpstered so he was trying to help there.
I felt like I did the right thing by trying to get us some advantage back later by making stacks. Aside from the fact we had unfavourable picks / lane matchups is there something I should have done to try and give Ursa a better lane?
Cheers.
For B: I remember Empire vs iG.V game on TI7 where iG.V won a comeback against mega creeps. Maybe you can take some note from that game?
Hi Crimson. Perhaps you need reassess your understanding of lanes because I find that shadow shaman and ursa (and rubick if he shows up) is one of the strongest lanes you could possibly have. If you were not finding kills I'd say the blame was probably yours.
On a separate note, pos 5 always make the same mistake when playing from behind - they feel that they can't leave base so they don't. But you need to think about what your cores want to be doing. If your carry actually wants to push out one lane but can't because of the lack vision, and you actually have an important save, you should split push with your carry to enable him to get as much farm as possible.
The pos 5 in most games would give the responsibility to the carry to not mess up. But often he does because he can't push alone. Don't blame him in that scenario as the fault is yours.
typical comments from supports on dotabuff: i spam support on this account and i have no idea what i am doing :D i guess it is called supporting
A:
If you are already far behind in levels a little extra doesn't really make the big of a difference. If you can save a core from dying, it is way more impactful. Go save the core and send him to farm the top lane. Even if you die in the process.
B:
As a support, you should try to get vision down to see the enemy coming... Especially sentries, so people about to die can't escape with shadow blades etc. A high ground defense is likely the best possible situation you can have. You have high ground advantage (as in ranged attacks miss 50% of the time + you have a tower there for some extra damage). Basically the most important thing is not to die for nothing. If you can find a pick off with smoke(someone farming solo) and then you can go on the offensive. And spread vision as you go. And try to push for more kills and towers while one of their heroes is down.
@Crimson Sky: What I like to do in these kind of situations is to chain pull. If you can't win the lane by trading hits then at least win the XP battle. Ogre + OD can't really dive an Ursa + SS, so they either have to contest your pulls (which gives Ursa some room to breathe) or just lose out on a lot of XP and gold.
Please sign in to post comments.
I’m pretty clueless as a support playing from behind.
There are two scenarios I have trouble dealing with.
A:
You are very behind in levels. Your team is fighting mid. There is a huge creep wave top. With your help or not, your team loses that fight, and enemy takes mid tower. But if you tp mid, you can save your mid or carry with the cost of your own life. (which puts you further behind in levels)
Do your take xp top, or save your mid or carry?
B:
Your enemy have the control of the entire map(properly warded, with their heroes farming everything), you have no ward on the map(all got counter warded, or you never got the chance to put when). Do you smoke out as 5, put down wards and take a fight(if you lose the fight, you lose the game, keep in mind, you have a higher chance of losing since you are behind). Do you stay on high ground, get further behind and defend high ground after your enemy take agis and cheese?