General Discussion

General Discussionofflane mirana

offlane mirana in General Discussion
Aethoeix

    Is it viable now? Does it work? What items? Utility with greaves? aghs? rightclick with diffsal/maelstrom?

    https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/3512935293

    Riguma Borusu

      the fact that you are farming the offlane just means you have a lower farm priority, if you can be that unstoppable mirana core with diffusal bkb mjollnir and whatever else, so be it

      don't try to play that hero way out of its comfort and usefulness zone for no reason

      Shou

        ive seen it
        u still build right click but u may decide to get an early drums or smth for better early fighting
        its rlly the same tho, but imo shud only be picked if u can contest the safelane and make ur offlane into the second safelane
        mirana with just xp is weak

        Melt

          If your carry or mid are tanky frontliners. Long base range gives you the opportunity to lh pretty safe, E is a descent esape. It works situationally.

          This comment was edited
          BenaoLifedancer

            Watch my profile and learn. No time to explain

            Shou

              Watch my profile and learn.

              4337
              SOLO MMR
              4368
              PARTY MMR
              3,215-3,111-57
              RECORD
              50.37%
              WIN RATE

              thanks so much benao really helped out a lot

              Cheap Laugh Guy

                Aghs is shit
                Right click carry mirana is the best right now
                If you're playing serious pos 3 just get utility items

                Riguma Borusu

                  I would never suggest anyone to "watch my profile and learn" unless I was 6k+
                  But Benao somehow believes he's good at dota or a specific hero despite being unable to even reach 5k. Have some self-restraint, jesus christ.

                  BenaoLifedancer

                    I play at the same level, be it against/with pros or against/with fucking 1k garbage. Rarely does the losing outcome of a match rest on my performance. I play effectively, people follow = perfect, people don't, I'm a feeding trash. I play the same altogheter.

                    Jacked

                      Damn benao shot up 300 mmr what happened ?

                      Jacked

                        Offlane Mirana seems ok if they have a weak safelaner. Otherwise it is bad? Usually what happens is the Mirana has to go roam anyway. But most offlane Mirana I see are bad

                        Rab

                          Offlane mirana is usually a freewin for the enemy team. Might work in 5k and below tho

                          A

                            hmm no.... many mirana player plays mirana offlane good winrate(51%) freewin :thinking:

                            https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/3512935293?guide=aa34d7

                            This comment was edited
                            Riguma Borusu

                              Rarely does the losing outcome of a match rest on my performance.

                              According to your winrate and general stats, the same could be said about the winning outcome, which would mean that you're one of those guys who takes all the credit for most victories but none of the credit for most losses (when a player only 500 MMR above you can point out how you fucked up big time.

                              I play effectively, people follow = perfect, people don't, I'm a feeding trash.

                              You know if you realized a lot of games are your fault, you might be able to hit 5k, I don't think you're as bad at dota as you are deluded (which stops you from getting better).

                              Shou

                                Benao has some level of skill cuz he hit 4k while being one of the most deluded retards I've ever seen

                                Lokieleven

                                  I like it, you have leap to get away if they go on you, you can arrow ceeeps to get gold and xp, build treads into difussal manta bkb then end.
                                  Her talents are pretty good too

                                  BenaoLifedancer

                                    Implying I'm a 4k and play like 1. Nice joke m8

                                    Riguma Borusu

                                      Benao has some level of skill cuz he hit 4k while being one of the most deluded retards I've ever seen

                                      Pretty much this.

                                      Implying I'm a 4k and play like 1. Nice joke m8

                                      I am implying you are responsible for your losses, but I am not implying you're 4k and play like one.

                                      That information is apparent from your profile, and arguing against it is arguing against the elo system, which is used in fucking chess and based on actual scientific research. In a way saying you don't play like a 4k is unscientific.

                                      BenaoLifedancer

                                        If you're an engineer or academic you're just sad.

                                        Unscientific would be saying I'm not currently 4k based on the information in my profile. But don't worry, the more stupid an engineer the better the future, unfortunately

                                        Riguma Borusu

                                          Since you wanted it...

                                          You have played 6k matches of this fucking game. During that time, your winrate has gone up and down many times. If your mean MMR was 5k throughout your playtime over 6k matches and the fluctuations caused you to fall to 4.3k then you could say you're a 5k player in general, but not currently, because that's part of the cycle. But this is asking for too much, because obviously you had to improve, so asking for mean MMR over all those games is stupid considering your CURRENT state. Even if we used data from the previous year or two years (and given less weight to older data), you still wouldn't be 5k, and that's apparent from the data I just took a brief look at.

                                          If I were to really get into calculating profile data off a random dota player's dotabuff, I'd probably find that your fluctuation point is about 4.4k and that while it has probably risen from 3k or something, it has never got to the 5k+ bracket which you believe you belong to.

                                          You go up to almost 5k or even 5k, then drop like a rock to 4k or even lower, then you get your MMR up but you can never stay above he 5k margin for a long peroid of time.

                                          This is because you aren't a 5k player, on average, and at the moment, you aren't even 5k according to the system, but also considering the prior data.

                                          If you don't understand what I am talking about, I drew it in crayons just for you:

                                          This is not a direct representation of your profile, since I'd have to actually use the dota api and process data and print out proper graphs, but just looking from how your winrate went up and down over the years, it's easy to conclude that your data is much more like this, and much less like a straight line towards 5k+ where you both average out on the 5k skill level and haev 5k MMR.

                                          The only thing you have going for you right now is that your winrate is much higher than it was prior to the last few months, so this means you can reach 5k, probably.

                                          However, considering the previous data, it's clear that even if you raise to 5k, you are likely to drop again. Maybe in 4-5 years your MMR will be 5k and you'll be able to keep it, and fluctuate above it, say, you still keep dropping 500 mmr and gaining 500 mmr on occassion, BUT the balance point is 6k! This would mean that you drop to 5k but also have the ability to grind up to 6k. This would make you, effectively, a 5.5k player over a specific amount of time.

                                          When taking place in chess tournaments, in some cases people don't give a shit about your current Elo, but, depending on the tournament, on the elo you have been able to "defend" or how fast you've gained it (so that further data might extrapolate to make you actually more skillfull than you appear from the number alone, this is what you think you are).

                                          What this means is that someone who gets 3k elo in chess and keeps it for a year is actually a better player than someone who just got there and is likely to lose it. Also, someone who just got 3k elo but is improving faster than most people, is effectively more skilled than 3k elo in most cases.

                                          TL;DR: Benao, you are not a 5k player, you are a 4k player on average, currently your MMR is 4k, you have an upward slope with MMR and winrate, but even if you reach 5k you're going to drop, because that's what happened every time so far, and your balance point is not 5k but 4.something k. Stop blaming others, start improving your own game, stop thinking you're the smartest, and you're likely to be 5k avg in no time because you are obviously skilled (who wouldn't be after 6k games they tried to win?), you just have a fucked up image of both yourself and the environment you're in.

                                          This comment was edited
                                          yung griphook

                                            I think it's legit but I'm only HS so who knows. I like it if you have a space-creating mid like a puck, storm, or QoP where you can take advantage of pushing lanes and farming camps, but if I have a farm-oriented mid I tend to make a space creating or team fight oriented offlaner instead. This doesn't necessarily mean it's right but it makes sense to my 3k brain.

                                            BenaoLifedancer

                                              Implying I wasn't among the peak when it mattered. Grats dude. I shouldn't play so much dota and do whatever, I should play as if i get paid and tryhard because dota is so important to my life. I should bend over and suck everyone so that I get a good dota team atmosphere and I should definitely let them fuck me over time and time again to gain some fulfillment to my life.

                                              I DO WHATEVER THE FUCK I WANT AND FEEL LIKE WHEN I PLAY DOTA

                                              Shou

                                                ^idk where u derived this from?
                                                r u illiterate, delusional, retarded, confused, or what?
                                                no one asked u to "get fucked over" whatever that means
                                                we r telling u to pull ur head out of ur ass and stop thinking ur hot shit when ur not
                                                ur actually so arrogant it approaches narcissism in my eyes, or at least what uve shown us
                                                id be relieved if u were a troll
                                                fucks sake

                                                Riguma Borusu

                                                  I used to be a relatively decent CS player in my teen years when I played the game a lot and had good reflexes and such. But I cannot live on past glory, I am fucking terrible now. I mean I am terrible at dota too but I am aware of it and I am not trying to change it.

                                                  When were you "among the peak"? What does that even mean, that you were at some point among the best players or that you used to be a really good player? I highly doubt it. Your behaviour and internal logic (blaming your teammates a lot) doesn't seem to suggest any of that. When did it matter? It matters now. If you want to say you are a good player NOW.

                                                  And no, you do not have to play dota at all, nobody is forcing you to do whatever, I am just saying that your way of thinking is completely delusional. What you do not seem to get is that being bad at dota is okay. Basically everyone who cannot reach at least 5k+ and keep it and also keep improving is kind of bad at the game.

                                                  But that's fine. I am telling you the exact opposite of what you think I am telling you. You cannot realize this because you want to claim to be really good and not try to be really good at the same time. You cannot do this shit. I could theoretically get 4k+ mmr pretty easily if I tried really hard. I have even played against 4k people in the past. That doesn't make me a 4k player, because I need to put a lot of effort to get there and even then there's no guarantee I will continue playing and improving to keep that MMR and improve further.

                                                  What you're saying is basically "I used to be better or I can get better so I am a good player" which is just kind of delusional. Potential does not equate to how things are. It is just potential. I have a potential to have a way bigger salary than I have right now, I just chose to do a job that I find more enjoyable, compared to the one that would pay a lot more. I cannot pay my bills with my potential money, any more than you can be really good at dota without putting effort to be really good at dota unless you're obviously talented which you are not.

                                                  And nobody is asking you to be really good at dota. Just drop the delusion that you actually know better than much better players, because if you did, then you'd have that blue star and a winrate that isn't 50% over 6k games. It doesn't matter why they have a bigger MMR - they are doing more things right than you are. You might hate people like cookie but he's so much better at the game than you are that you can't even start to comprehend because you live in the delusion that you always know the best (which you cannot translate into actions).

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                                                  BenaoLifedancer

                                                    No, I'm saying I'm not gonna adapt to trash play even if it means winning more. Either you step it up or fuck you, I don't give a fuck about the outcome of a game

                                                    Riguma Borusu

                                                      Not wanting to adapt literally makes you bad at the game, because the goal of the game is to win it (duh). It doesn't matter how good you think you are at last hitting, taking towers, teamfights or having map awareness, if you completely ignore what the win condition is. Dota isn't a game of "I know how I want to win" it is the game of "I need to recognize the best way to win with my current skills and improve them further". You should also stop giving advice that you use to lose games (because you won't adapt) to people who actually want to win games.

                                                      The only advice I am sure I can give to people is the advice that I had already been given by much better players, that I had either used or not because I didn't care.

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                                                      Shou

                                                        No, I'm saying I'm not gonna adapt to trash play even if it means winning more.

                                                        how tf can u say a play is trash if it wins more?
                                                        u cud say its boring or uninteresting or repetetive, but how is it trash?
                                                        ????

                                                        Riguma Borusu

                                                          What Benao is doing is equivalent to not using the queen piece in chess because somehow it's overpowered and not fun to play with. Doing this is fine but claiming some sort of superiority because you are somehow not using the "op shit" is just stupid.

                                                          This comment was edited