General DiscussionEnigma viable this patch?

yes

but dont think you're any good

only retards jungle engima

''oh let's take one of the best laning heroes in the game that can basically solo a 3lane and let's go jungle instead huhuehuehuehuehue''

Enigma has always been fantastic, but jungle has been nerfed so horribly that he should not be played there.

Edit: also that last game your am had a 21min bf and your pa also for some reason build one. I blame your carries. Your item build is fine.

ok so an antimage gets forced into offlane because enigma is too stupid to play lane or pick support instead of enigma and you blame the antimage?

WHAT?

enigma jungle was a thing that went out of meta 4 years ago

enigma offlane is good, but i need to learn how to fucking micro those eidolons properly so i dont just get myself killed.
also do u go soul ring or arcanes?

I do believe enig was good in jungle before jungle gold got nerfed. It is the fault of all parties to correct my earlier statement.

most people go arcanes into midas

but it's not uncommon to see brown boots>sr> midas>arcanes or brown>sr>arcanes>midas.

@jack, no, jungle has been killed a very long time ago

it's just that low mmr players play it because they're too bad to lane.

at best you can get good at compensating for lost lanes and get stuck in low priority because of jungle.

and you don't even know how much it's game losing to go jungle, in any of the last 3 years of patches.

my roaming juingle used to lose me games because i couldn't compensate for the lost lanes, and i'd leave jungle at 5-7 minutes

not to mention this retardation of 20 min afk jungling that OP did

ok so an antimage gets forced into offlane because enigma is too stupid to play lane or pick support instead of enigma and you blame the antimage?

I didn't blame anyone? also he choose it himself lol.
So i should just solo offlane him? And just go the build you mentioned above?
Also sorry for being a shitbag and not being 9k godlike like everyone else on dotabuff i guess.

grab some high mmr replays and play like them, not afk jungle 20 minutes then ask why you can't win.

how can you not see the flaw in your own gameplay.

I could never understand the people who come here and ask about why are they losing without even putting 1% of critical thought into their own gameplay.

yes
but dont think you're any good

Very helpfull. Nice winrate tho.

I could never understand the people who come here and ask about why are they losing without even putting 1% of critical thought into their own gameplay.

it is a constructive comment

because you did something extremely counter-productive to the point that if you did hte same thing in a 6k avg match, the game literally would've been over by 10 minutes.

and i mean literally, you wouldn't even get to that 20 minute part.

the comment was very constructive, use your brain and re-evaluate every single action that you did in your gameplay because it's clearly corrupted by low mmr habbits.

''oh let's take one of the best laning heroes in the game that can basically solo a 3lane and let's go jungle instead huhuehuehuehuehue''

Let me guess u're talking about a high quality trilane like drow, spectre and invoker.

Enigma is situational pick, mostly useless and bad. He's pretty dead, just drop him for now.

Let me guess u're talking about a high quality trilane like drow, spectre and invoker.
Enigma is situational pick, mostly useless and bad. He's pretty dead, just drop him for now.

what are you insane? even if he doesn't kill them, even against a coordinated high mmr 3lane enigma owns the lane by constantly forcing supports to stay there.

and not to even mention how easy it is to kill a low mmr 3lane while playing enigma.

maybe he is not a high tier pick in the current meta, but he is not dead.

and there's quite a few matches as enigma in the recent time by high ranking/pro offlaners like forev or mag

Enigma will feed like a monkey or afk jungle being useless while getting rekt beyond belief. It's mostly a useless hero and only picked very situationally. If enigma was that what you're pretending him to be, he'd not be picked as rarely as he's now, or is this some new next level cookie strat the 6k+ plebs didn't get yet?

Enigma is actually so trash that he would get solod by most popular carries 1v1 after a couple of level advantages ROFL. His main issue is that beyond his ultimate he doesn't provide anything usefull.

Stop playing on your smurf, you're getting autsitic.

Enigma will feed like a monkey or afk jungle being useless while getting rekt beyond belief. It's mostly a useless hero and only picked very situationally. If enigma was that what you're pretending him to be, he'd not be picked as rarely as he's now, or is this some new next level cookie strat the 6k+ plebs didn't get yet?

Enigma is actually so trash that he would get solod by most popular carries 1v1 after a couple of level advantages ROFL. His main issue is that beyond his ultimate he doesn't provide anything usefull.

how the fuck would an lane stomper feed a solo carry, where's your logic?

even against strong 3lanes enigma can just deny range creep and go take a sidecamp which causes the wave to push towards him, you'll almost never kill a good enigma.

Not to mention how much he shits on basically almost any hero 1v1, considering that he'll always be super high level because of the sidecamps.

The main issue is that low mmr players only think enigma can black hole, because applying logic is too hard.

Stop playing on your smurf, you're getting autsitic.

sorry that i'm not a 4k who can't apply reasoning to my thoughts.

@blunt
proof blunt is 4k
i cant think of many carries who can outlane eidolons
but wtf do i know
nibba makes it hard for enemy to hg, is good at counter initiating, can split push well, farms well and then builds all sorts of items to help the team.

He writes so much shit, yet he doesn't understands why people make fun of him RoFoL. Bosnian 5k pride > 6k+ Players. Better make a team with 4 bots and win TI, such insight.

Sorry that you don't play against skilled players and honestly think engima offlane is the shiet. RoFoL

he writes so much shit, yet he doesn't understand why people make fun of him. Danish 4k > 5k bosnian player. Because making a logical counter argument is too much work, go win a ranked game, such insight.

And yet, you fail to read, i did never state that he's top tier, but he is still a strong offlaner.

Sorry boy, at 5k you still get 6-7k avg matches at least 1 in 5 games, even if i don't play much on my 5k accs.

Pls mastah, maek cukie guide for 5k, need halp plsplsplspslsp. I 4k pleb...

How u not Ti winner yet? Please tell us ur secretz.

Enigma offlain gud shiet, all high skiel players are plebs for not knowing how stronk enigma offlain is. Pls enlighten 6k+ plebs how awsum enigma offlain is. plsplspslpslps improve le skiel of dota playas

i'm yet to see a single 6k comment in this thread.

i have no reason to argue over well established working strategies used by 7k+ players, not me.

i haven't played 5 games of enigma in the last year, but that doesn't mean i don't understand how the meta works.

Anyways, since you already started acting like a kid, you clearly have no counter argument, you'd attack me rather than the gameplan.

so this pathetic argument is over for me.

Cuz they won't bother explaining why enigma offlane is dogshit to a deluded retard who thinks he can literally make a guide to make 1k shits 5k.

You gotta be the special kind of retard to think that it's that simple, then again u're already proving how bad 5k players are.

yea, considering my guide was about 10% done. That guide is literally made to explain all of the things that i did to get from 1k to 5k and how a 1k could use it now.

that guide is literally made to have the same effect that, aka bringing a 1k to 5k.

You gotta be a quite self defensive little 4k retard who can't get better so he wants to prove to himself that 5ks are bad and to not feel shit about himself, pathetic.

^At least he's trying instead of just breaking people down like you are. We can't all have an IQ of 140 like you do right?

maybe explain why enigma would be considered a bad offlaner then?

I talked to a couple of people who got coached by cookie, and honestly all said the same, his guide, his coaching and pretty much anything aside from basics where dogshit.

Even after his wannabe dogshit guide, people didn't gain shit. Hell he even got trolled by high mmr players for his shitty guides.

You're saying he's trying, but he's only making it worse. He's deluding low MMR players that it's so fucking easy getting 5k+ by just reading 1 guide, suddenly they start trashtalking people who point out the shit cookie is writing. He's baisically raising a deluded retard group.

Why enigma offlane is bad? Pretty simple.
- Easy to zone
- Very easy to kill, low movementspeed, very squishy, no escape
- Easy to kill 1v1 once u got levels above him
- Ult way to long cooldown, doesn't provide much aside from that
- Due to enigma being useless early it's either a 40min+ game or get shitstomped (most are shitstomps btw)

There are way better offlane heroes. Hell just go on live tab and filter for enigma, U'll see how much the hero sucks dick in high MMR games (if you find a high game that is, almost noone goes offlane enigma other than trying something out of randoming the hero, very rarely u'll see a situational pick that would work against insanely shitty lanes.)

I'd say enigma has become very situational now. I played an insane amount of enigma in the last 3 months (over 150 games or so), and I can assure you the newest patches made him much more difficult. Jungle isn't as viable, and having a strong off lane works better in the long run. I still believe his ultimate scales really well late game, and can crush an overfed HC to start giving your team a chance.

I'd say learn to play him well offlane and you'll be golden again

I still believe his ultimate scales really well late game, and can crush an overfed HC to start giving your team a chance.

And this is the issue. Once u get relevant the game is either over or hard. In high MMR games you'll mostly get shitstomped before u're useful in any way. Hell of u want an offlaner with a teamfight ult and impact, then go for tide.

Personally me thinks that any form of late game is pretty bad this patch. Engima is a late game teamfighter, who excels at locking down a hero (or group) of heroes down.

The problem is the high pick of Silence heroes (Silencer, Blood) Early game teamfighters (Axe, Tide, Phoenix) and Single Target Lockdowns (Lion and Rhasta)

I do that intentionally, i'm a free coach, not a paid coach. I'm not going to try hard with every student, only those who survive elimination phase get knowledge.

almost literally every player who gets past my eliminatory phase gets at least 500-1000 mmr increases.

and I've stated this in literally any guide or coaching i did, i'll make you work just to eliminate the 90% of the players who physically can't or are too lazy to improve. I'm not gonna make the mistake of coaching someone like artmiss again, to realize she spent hundreds of $$$ to pay pro tier coaches, those pro high mmr coaches everyone just loves so much to endorse(like bsj or purge), and yet the only mmr she gained was the one i boosted on her account.

why your statements are wrong:

- Easy to zone
- Very easy to kill, low movementspeed, very squishy, no escape
- Easy to kill 1v1 once u got levels above him
- Ult way to long cooldown, doesn't provide much aside from that
- Due to enigma being useless early it's either a 40min+ game or get shitstomped (most are shitstomps btw)

- supports will naturally have less regen, meaning he can easily do the oposite and zone the supports out with basically none
- starting build is almsot always boots of speed
- won't happen because he denies range creeps and farms the sidecamps at very low levels
- unlike 4k's who have no imagination, enigma is not only a ''black hole machine''
- lane stomper being useless, nice joke

there are way better offlaners, and i never stated that enigma is a top tier pick.

I can't help but feel that you're desprately trying to talk yourself out of being a full on retard. And u're failing.

Also

- supports will naturally have less regen, meaning he can easily do the oposite and zone the supports out with basically none

ye go trade with the eidolons + enigma as a hero with 2 tangoes and a salve and tell me how it worked out for you genius.

my statements have a logical proven background, you only attempt to draw out emotion because you can't make a proper argument.

Your statements are the logical proven background of 1k - 2k avg mmr matches.

Yeah, very emotional pointing out the flaws in your logic

I can't help but feel that you're desprately trying to talk yourself out of being a full on retard. And u're failing.

yea, i can see how this points to so many flaws in my logic.

My statements have a logical proven background of analyzing 7k+ avg matches.

present your case against me, because i see nothing other than a little emotional kid trying to desperately grasp for air while drowning in his own bullshit because he doesn't want to attempt a counter argument.

Or do i have to stoop complete to your level to make any point, because logic doesn't work for you.

Ofc u can't see how the points are showing ur logical flaws since u're deluded, it's like saying a brick wall is hard. Duh.

U're deluded and dumb as fuck, hence people making fun our little bosnian pride playa.

Cuz they won't bother explaining why enigma offlane is dogshit to a deluded retard

explaining why enigma offlane is dogshit to a deluded retard

enigma offlane is dogshit to a deluded retard

to a deluded retard

deluded retard

Ofc you're an emotional kid who can't control his own defense mechanisms.

because you clearly haven't stated a counter case to my points, only attacked me personally.

So please, keep proving me right.

says the 4k who bought a 6k account then gains a mega superiority complex abt explaining things to someone who is 1k mmr higher than u

1k deluded dogshit joined the chat. Why don't you contribute with a case as to why enigma carry with armlet is the shit? Since u're dumb as fuck.

Are you sucking 5k bosnian prides dick? You're both deluded and retards, you make a nice couple. Go marry each other.

EDIT:
Why is a deluded 5k trashcan trying to start a discussionwith me? In order to get a proper discussion with anyone u need to be on equal ground. Right now I'm on a skyscraper looking down on a dirty 5k bosnian arc spammer who shouts bathes in dirt. Arguing with a deluded retard such as yourself is a massive waste of time, because no matter how much sense it makes your little bosnian pride won't ever accept it as reality. So Instead I'll do the same as everyone else, redicule and insult you, because you're not worth starting a discussion with.

i'll rest my case here, since you went full out name-calling without even attempting to counter argument, i'll just conclude that you don't have any, so i'll stop wasting my time and go to sleep.

Go make guide on how to offlane enigma to 7k+. You clearly are top tier analyzer who will maek 1k dotabuff plebs grind the way to 7k+ with offlane enigma.

1k deluded dogshit joined the chat. Why don't you contribute with a case as to why enigma carry with armlet is the shit? Since u're dumb as fuck.
Are you sucking 5k bosnian prides dick? You're both deluded and retards, you make a nice couple. Go marry each other.

@Cookie hmm I'm getting some serious case of Deja Vu. Didn't you back out of an argument with others when they prove facts before?

Then didn't you call the other people who try to post their opinion's "Dog shit and retarded"?

I don't result to name calling recently, but I think this happened before, but the terms were flipped. I don't like RTCD or Blunt either, but you're no knight in shinning armor in my book.

1k guy still talking. Interesting.

Say something funny monkey. Entertain me some more. While u're at it, post some more normal matches and ask for thoughts.

@Cookie hmm I'm getting some serious case of Deja Vu. Didn't you back out of an argument with others when they prove facts before?

Then didn't you call the other people who try to post their opinion's "Dog shit and retarded"?

He does it all the time, because he's deluded as fuck. Hence I won't waste time and make fun of him instead.

why is a 4k acct buyer calling a 5k person trash?
i dont like cookie guides cuz they rnt worth the time to learn em, tedious and boring.
but i can at least respect that he is better than me.

Why is a deluded 5k trashcan trying to start a discussionwith me? In order to get a proper discussion with anyone u need to be on equal ground. Right now I'm on a skyscraper looking down on a dirty 5k bosnian arc spammer who shouts bathes in dirt. Arguing with a deluded retard such as yourself is a massive waste of time, because no matter how much sense it makes your little bosnian pride won't ever accept it as reality. So Instead I'll do the same as everyone else, redicule and insult you, because you're not worth starting a discussion with.

Right now I'm on a skyscraper looking down on a dirty 5k bosnian arc spammer who shouts bathes in dirt.

looking down on a dirty 5k bosnian arc spammer who shouts bathes in dirt.

looking down on a dirty 5k bosnian arc spammer

5k bosnian arc spammer

1k is on repeat. have you tried picking riki yet? I heard it's stronk 1k hero.

Have you considered to stop being a monkey with braincancer so you can escape 1k bracket?

cookies a dickhead who cant understand the perspective of a lower mmr player
blunt is the same but much worse, he cant understand the perspective of other human beings
imma copy wenmer here
if i wanted to kill myself, blunt, i wud climb up to ur ego and jump down to ur iq

@Blunt you make a fair point

@Neko Gamer Soul

i do it, and i know it's a terrible habbit to keep calling people retarded.

but even when i do it, i still present my argument almost every single time, unless it's an extremely low effort post.

1k trying to make smart jokes. I bet you had to google at least 5 hours and wrote it down for this very moment. U're dumb as fuck, incompetent, useless, trash and competely irrelevant, noone cares what a dumb 1k monkey thinks.

All we can do as human beings is watching you jumping in your cage raging with your little banana.

i do it, and i know it's a terrible habbit to keep calling people retarded.

if you believe enigma = black hole you're a fucking retard

enigma = 85% black hole.

Fite me 3k tard.