Triple is op's gf
E: give old NBA Kitrak back, not this lifestealer dog
A very in depth analysis about the simple details around the game. I like this post. I'm at 2.9k mmr and I always try to fulfill the points you mentioned. Basically it's just a question of self-discipline and the ability to critize yourself in an objective way.
LOL "PLAY EVERY ROLE"
IN THIS CASE, WHY THE FUCK ALL TOP MMR PLAYERS (and u, kitrak, too) have mid heroes as most played? I've never seen a high mmr guy with offlaners or supports as most played. 80% - tinker, invoker, storm, wr. 20% - some above average difficulty carries like naga siren, meepo or morphling
let's just put it straight:
u only can achieve 5k+ if u learn some "pro" mid/hard carry heroes well. maybe with VERY RARE games as a support or whatever is required (70% of whitch are gonna be lost for sure)
but when u'r playing a ~4k mmr game there re ppl who are definitely deserve more and ppl who bought their accs and go down or not just good enough. Implying im a person who deserves more - should i pick cores only to climb?
When should one pick support? Is it better to counter the opponent's heroes or give the farming heroes a slight edge by picking support first?
thanks for answering!
dude stop with the fucking 4k account buyers its a myth. maybe u get like 1 acc buyer in 30 games or even less since ur playing on europe
if ure below 6k just play whatever u need to win ur game really be it core or support
im a core player and i really suck at supporting but i get 6k+ avg games and im forced to play supp or some roaming shit, unless my teammates dont want to and tell me to pick core
When i m picking support - i gank, ward, win early game but retarded cores fuck up late game in 70% of cases.
Im sorta transitioning into semi-core every sup game i have: i have a lot of gold, assists and often have killing streaks (not on purpose of ks)
I feel that i'm better than the majority of ppl i meet in my games
Ye im doing better as sup according to my stats. But the reason behind it isn't about my skill
Almost every time i pick mid or carry (like in case of slark and od) - i have a lot of kills, herodmg, kda, etc. but i still lose because my carry has 300 gpm despite farm being close to uncontested or i get mid who is 0 5 0 in 5 mins when im carry (my supports barely do any rotations)
![[Lk].Zano](https://steamcdn-a.akamaihd.net/steamcommunity/public/images/avatars/b9/b98e01ce6ef4a5e926a44cdd1564d0e8e5fbfa36_full.jpg "[Lk].Zano")
All very good points.
Seeing as you talking a lot about emotion, I think you could mention confirmation bias somewhere in there. It's a fact that most people tend to only remember games where their teammates played like garbage or when they carried some game with significantly better stats than the rest of people, while disregarding games with even skilled or better players.
Thanks for this. I climbed from 900 to 3k over the past few months by just analysing my replays and acknowledging that I have a fuckload to learn in this game. I recently started getting back into the attitude of "my teammates are holding me down", to the point where I would intentionally feed or just not do anything for minor reasons, and reading this thread really smacked that out of me.
Ya know, the funny thing about 123 is that he's doing exactly as kitrak is describing. You refuse to believe that you can win games as a support, so you pick core regardless of what your team is doing already resulting in 5 core strats that get steamrolled within 10 minutes. You think you're only going to win if you play mid / core because your teammates are idiots and you are the only one in the game who can see that. You compare yourself to the 2-10 lion on your team, completely ignoring the fact that even in good games supports stats look like total dogshit.
@123 honestly from the way you've been responding, I can tell you seriously suck at this game ayy lmao. it was already written above
"playing whatevers required is more of a "pick to win, not pick to play ur role" sort of thing. if ur picking mid because you're a really good mid player, then thats picking to win, but 90% of the time the people that are picking mids arent actually better than other players at that role, theyre just delusional and believe that "teammates = noobs me win only if me pick mid and go 20--0 on sf jaja""
maybe mid/carry might be your best role but its obvious enough that you're not GOOD enough to win games on your own which conversely also means you won't ever succeed with them even at something low like 5k flat or high 4k so whats your point, that you deserve to be 200-300 mmr higher? no1 rlly cares if you're 3700 or 4000
its like a scenario where som1s mocking you for being a part timer and mac donald and you go, "wtf dont put me on that level im a supervisor" :|
instead of finding excuses and convincing urself that ur better cuz your teammates in this game obviously dont
http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/2302885636
http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/2316810992
@123 are you telling us bulldog played druid and np mid to reach his bracket? Last time i checked he went offlane
As long as im keeping 3 heroes on my lane im a happy guy.
>Don't give up!
I feel like carry and mid is pretty easy to play, but I get totally lost when I have to play position 4/5. Fail a few ganks and I'm under-leveled and just have zero impact. Do you think if you dedicated yourself to watching replays of the abovementioned players I'd be a much better player?
yeah replays... it always shocks me how many cs I miss =(
In that thread where I went off about juggernaut cs, it was like blink vs yasha on jug, some guy posted a match where he had very high farm so I actually watched it. And he got his farm cus the offlaner spoon fed him 5 kills. It was shocking how much cs he straight up missed in lane cus he wasn't paying attention or was like buying shit or just missed them.
If you're going to carry probably the easiest way to get better is by improving farm cus 3k players suck so badly at farming.
"I feel like carry and mid is pretty easy to play, but I get totally lost when I have to play position 4/5. Fail a few ganks and I'm under-leveled and just have zero impact. Do you think if you dedicated yourself to watching replays of the abovementioned players I'd be a much better player?"
You feel that way cus carry IS super easy to play when supports make space for you. Give me 10 minutes of lane free farm and as long as you haven't fed their safe lane kill I'm going to win. This is anecdotal of course, but free farm carry games are super easy to pull off, while securing that free farm on a support can be tough. That's why it feels easy, and the games where it was hard and you lost, you tend to forget.
See that's what I'm talking about. I need to watch replays and learn the patterns of a good roamer so that the enemy mid rage quits I raped him so hard. Like DJ enchantress
Is the first post a copy/paste from somewhere? Because it looks like Kitrak's personality turned by 180 degrees. I always thought that he is an as***le, but he looks like nice and clever person here. I'm confused...
Supports are actually easier to climb with. Of the heroes who have >50% winrate most are supports.
If we cant play after we are tilted I guess no one in the 3k brackets can play more than 1 game a day.. :D
Anyway Kitrak, anything you can tell me from my game stats? Ignore my last Slark game, I fought with my teammates and was throwing..
All the normal skill games are party BTW..
Please sign in to post comments.
since ive got nothing better to do on a saturday morning i figured i may as well assist those of u who want to get to a higher mmr.
ill preface this by saying u shouldnt be trying to climb mmr for the sake of a number or because you think ur teammates are awful. you should be doing it so that you can learn more about the game, get better at it, enjoy it more, and have more fun games. if this isnt what u are looking to do, don't bother - its not worth getting a high mmr if you can only play 2 or 3 heroes and you havent even learned those heroes well.
-mmr is NOT indicative of player "skill" - its indicative of a players ability to win games. meaning the reason that the shitty dazzle who wont grave you is at your mmr is because hes picking real supports over junglers and doing other tihngs to win. theres tons of things people can do to win games. your mmr is exactly where it should be - but that doesnt mean ur a worse player than the people around you, it just means you arent trying hard enough to win by doing everything possible to win. most of the time, this is having a shitty attitude - giving up too easily, not trying to help ur teammates out, etc. take it from someone who climbed from 5.6k to near 7k in 15 days - its really not that hard to win games if you do everything possible to win and never lose sight of ur goal.
-understand basic math. you arent going to win every game. dont complain about single losses that you have. if you've ever opened this forum, theres always 2-3 threads about people who claim that a game was "unwinnable." you're on a statistics site. perhaps its a good idea to consider that climbing mmr means you need a winrate above 50%, not 100%. instead of complaining about individual losses where 4 players on your team went 0-10, focus on the games that were close - the 50 minute games where you're 11-9 on antimage or something where you definitely could have played better. if you win those close games, chances are you'll have a 60% winrate and you'll climb fast.
-streaks are an important concept to understand. in order to climb mmr, you have to understand yourself. if youre in a shitty mood or feel like you wont try in a game because that lion last game wouldnt pull or something and you're on tilt, just dont queue. as a general rule of thumb, dont queue any more games if you've lost two in one day, regardless of how many wins you've had. likewise, if ur in a good tryhard mood, keep queueing.
-be open to playing other roles. if you're a 6k player, playing mid at 2ks obviously easy, but if you're actually at 2k mmr, you're not going to win any more games playing mid than you would any other roles. unfortunately, while it might seem "fair" to spite the guy who stole your mid by picking storm and dual laning mid, you would have a much better chance of winning if you picked omni and pressed ur heal and repel on people.
-dont be egotistical. in other words, be nice and respectful to ur teammates. make jokes at the start of games to lighten the mood, say random shit, act high or whatever. itll make them more conducive to listening to you and each other and make playing the game more fun and less of a chore which is why u should be playing anyway. being cancerous doesnt help u win games. thinking ur teammates suck doesnt win games.
-if ur stuck at a certain mmr, go and watch ur last loss, pause every minute or so and take 2 minutes and ask yourself three questions. what am i doing right now? is there something better i could be doing? if so, how would i accomplish that task in this specific game scenario? i can guarantee you that if all you''re doing is spamming the find match button, you''ll never really get better at the game or at the very least you'll be improving at an insanely slow speed. if you're open to the idea that you do make mistakes, you'll improve quite quickly by watching replays and looking for specific things that you could have done. im always confused when i run into threads asking "hey watch my replay what can i do better?" because thats something you should take upon yourself to do. as you get better itll get easier to do this and youll recognize mistakes a lot quicker and solutions quicker, and thats very important even in game. maybe ill do a video where i take someones replay and show u what i mean by this because i think this is the easiest way to actually improve at dota but its incredibly boring
-please be nice to your teammates. ur at the same mmr for a reason.
-a little bit of basic logic. if you are playing a game, statistically, you'll win >50% games (climb mmr) if you have more of an impact in your role than the opposing player of the same role. so instead of comparing yourself to ur 2-10 lion, compare yourself to the enemy mid or enemy carry or jungler did.
-the point of playing dota is to have fun, if its a burden or a chore take a break for hours or days and if it doesnt become less of a chore dont play. you wont win games if you arent enjoying them.
-based on the earlier idea that you winning games is dependent on you having more impact than the opposing player in the same role, there's two things that determine impact: how much of a heros potential you can fulfill, and how does that heroes potential fit into the game? the first is the most important question because getting "outpicked" doesnt really matter if you have a better command of your heroes than your opponents. a good way to measure the first question is something like "how much more impact would arteezy have on this hero?" thus, heroes like antimage or pa are usually awful choices in most games unless youre like 6k or something because playing a good antimage requires you to be a top notch carry player - ive never seen a good antimage who wasnt insanely good at other heroes. and if you arent a good antimage, youll lose 60% of your games. for the second question, this is where the meta comes in. you might be able to play wraith king to 80% potential, but wraith king against QW invoker or pl is just suicide, your game impact will suck. likewise, playing meta heroes is really good because they fit in a lot of situations and can have good impact based on sheer hero strength, especially if youve seen people play this hero and know how to use it at a basic level.
i dont do many of these things but i did them for like two weeks and i went up like 1.2k mmr in that time period so im sure if you want to do this it cant be that difficult to do. i know for a fact im significantly lower skill mechanically than most high 6k/low 7k players but i win games because i play whatever role, i dont flame and i play with my team.
also a side note, if youre a 4k or 5k whos trying to get high mmr to join a team, dont spam the op mids or carries of the patch. it makes you look really shitty in the eyes of most high mmr players. nobody whos 6k or 7k thinks very highly of you if you were 5k and spammed invoker/od/spectre on 686 to get high mmr. i dunno what the patch heroes are but if you are going to play patch heroes, dont limit yourself to 2-3 of them, play like 10 of them minimum so you can improve at more things.