this guy plays es mid... ages ago..... http://www.dotabuff.com/players/106497354
he has the best build and a good mid es player... better than rest of the scrubs
he does that, so he can last hit one with aftershock and one with totem
I can only imagine the horror that would happen to ES if he goes mid vs rzr, dp, ta, sf or even necro (worst mid hero). God forbid he lanes vs trax or od.
^ wave control mechanics + guaranteed runes mitigate alot of the advantages of range vs melee
^ assuming the non-es player can't control the wave. Also assuming that creeps aren't at his tower when runes spawn. And also assuming he doesn't meet offlaner such as Clock or Bat contesting the other rune.
What I want to say if non-ES player has any idea about the game he will destroy ES mid.
its like zenoth said
if you start stout with 2 pooled tangos>bottle rush you don't need to worry too much about sustain, you can 100% secure runes with proper positioning + fissure against any non blink hero
and people keep insisting that mid es only works if you out skill your opponent are retarded, "he will destroy ES mid." like wtf you don't need to win the lane as es, you don't even need to break even the lane; you just want some farm and mainly the exp.
the thing about 1-1-3 build is that you punish anyone that attempts to dive you and 6 onwards you're the one zoning the opponent out (465+echos mgc dmg, 3.6 second stun, about 5 auto attacks) if they go at you with anything less than full hp you smash them. play him as a countergank mid and camp mid till you get blink and you just rollover enemies with 1k burst pre-level 10
1-2-2 build sounds better to me. i dont think you can go hit, spell, hit, spell with lvl 1 ministun.
also why would you pick es mid vs ta/necro/razor. es mid is damn situational.
Again assuming that your opponent will allow you to do any of those things.
But you have right to think the other way. Even if it's wrong.
Pub wise, noone really gives much of a damn lol. It might even be easier because enemies won't place emphasis on ganking you and the enemy mid probably thinks you're a dumbfuck who could never pose a threat.
1-1-3 provides same single target damage at level 5 but with slightly longer stun and easier farming with AoE damage. 100% bonus should be enough that you don't miss a last hit with enchant, right? Level 6 it does slightly more damage so 1-1-3 into 1-4-3 is usually the safest choice because it assumes that enemies won't let you enchant before walking up to them.
Es is by no means autowin lane/game but with this upcoming patch I think he becomes a decent and viable mid. Goodsnowball and long stun keeps him relevant even if his damage falls off late game.
ember is weaker in lane than earthshaker and goes mid fairly successfully, no idea wtf you are smoking
i could lane ES vs TA and do better than with other "traditional mids"
@GG
you're using very flawed logic. Its like if you were trying to tell me Slark is currently a strong snowball pub hero and I go "but who would let you snowball? Lame hero weak if not fed"
like what
Or if you explain how Ravage is a strong late game AoE disable. "But why would enemies group up or not use BKB? Sucks dumb spell long cd"
If you don't want to accept what I say, then it doesn't matter how hard I try to explain, no?
Ok, let me correct myself. I would destroy any ES mid with any of the heroes I listed. No matter who plays the ES, be it 8k mmr player.
no, the point is that ember is run mid successfully very often, but earthshaker is better equipped to lane mid than he is, along with getting better mileage out of rune control - there's no reason why earthshaker cant be successfully run mid when ember does that all the time
but guess you're too narrow minded/stupid to see that, guess there's no point arguing
Sorry, didn't understand what u meant. You got a point.
But still ES is a crap mid. Extremely situational. And no, new patch will not change that.
it's not a bad mid at all, he is tanky, has good attack animation and base damage, has big solo kill potential at lv6 and benefits a lot from an early dagger
please elaborate why do you think he's a crap mid
http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1089730143
this may not be the best example as it was unranked and Invoker was not as good as me but it still shows a point
starting with stout + QB, invoker can't last hit for shit. add a solo kill at lv6 to that and you have a very early blink dagger which is a recipe for a pubstomp
Wanna play mid Earthshaker? why be a pretender tusk when you could play a kick ass support es?
Earthshaker will always have a better influence by roaming and getting a blink, than building damage and getting a single crit on one hero.
That's why pro players picked shaker mid at TI4, because they're bad, stupid and don't want the prize money
Its fine mid. You dont always have to kill oponents mid hero in order to be effective.
Even really good players easily underestimate the burst es has. In order to truly understand it you have to play es yourself.
well no shit, of course shaker is coming out on top of he has a SWM ganking puck from the side..the moment you add in shit like that, the 1v1 match up at mid doesn't mean anything, and there is no point to a discussion like this
@rofl, great match against an invoker with a 35% win rate and 47 CS in a 30 minute game, that is some compelling evidence right there. I'm assuming that you had ogre and SWM gank him early, but even still, that is just fucking horrific
"this may not be the best example as it was unranked and Invoker was not as good as me"
@Commodore, blink shaker combo is about hitting 2 enchants in like a second which is the equivalent of a 1000% crit. Freaking tusk is trying to be a pretender shaker
It's good, but a Puck still can do more with a dagger most of the time and will be easier for her to get it. But if there are no lanes for him he can easily go mid and it won't be some game losing stuff.
@rofl, so you played against some retards, which I guess is the norm for south american servers, and still felt that it was worth posting here? or are you trying to lower the perceived quality of the shit servers that we play on?
do you really think that invoker "starting with stout + QB, invoker can't last hit for shit" ??
In a pure 1v1 match up invoker will do perfectly fine against ES and easily "win" the lane. Then he will start spamming cold snap, tornado and EMP, and ES won't be very happy about it. He will still get something, but no this isn't an easy match up for ES.
"when this guy gets that blink at level 9, he literally does a 4.5 second stun, 560++ aoe magic dmg and 10 auto attacks worth of damage. that new 20 mana cost is game breaking."
Enchant Totem mana cost reduced from 50 to 20/30/40/50
so it's still 50 at level 9, not really making him stronger, just easier to sustain @early levels
@Shredder : what items is mid es picking up? I wanna see how this calculates out because I have tried both Tusk and Es mid and tusks ability to close down and throw opponents out of position is far more influential than the damage.
Es could block off an escape with a fissure - yes - he could then run up and hit with an enchant, re enchant and go for a second hit doing at a base level more damage.
Tusk on the otherhand has multiple ways of initiating. Shards is very strong at putting opponents in a bad position while dealing good magic damage. He can also roll in and then shards. His walrus punch while unable to do it twice will still do 350% damage and a 2-4s slow. All the while tusk can put down a sigil and basically ruin any counter initiation while slowing a very nearly dead enemy.
This is why tusk just feels more suited to a mid position than an earthshaker.
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with the reduction of mana for enchant, a 1-1-3 build is totally viable now.
when this guy gets that blink at level 9, he literally does a 4.5 second stun, 560++ aoe magic dmg and 10 auto attacks worth of damage. that new 20 mana cost is game breaking.
its not like he'll wreck mid with it but it means he's able to farm much much more than before and once he gets blink he wrecks almost every mid
like people who have never tried playing an ES with a 8/9 min blink with a 1-4-4-1 build might not get it but theres a huuuuge difference.