General Discussion

General DiscussionGood support heroes to pick against farm heavy heroes like Antimage

Good support heroes to pick against farm heavy heroes like Antimage in General Discussion
Magician of Moonlight

    Seriously wondering what supports are good at shutting down fast farming heroes like him to get a better chance of winning.

    kowareta

      none?
      might es the green one be good, but its last pick mid job to take care of him. brood, meepo, ta -> gg

      meepo is trash tho, thats why this garbage hero is back

      This comment was edited
      ReHa

        retarded question , how can a support shut down farming carry wtf

        ScaredyCat

          Steal their farm instead? Or you can ward their camps?

          Hatrið mun sigra

            Shaker, Spirit Breaker, Skywrath, Ogre, Lina, AA, Jakiro, Silencer. All these heroes are imo good at chasing an AM around the map when he's still weak, granted they most of the times need +1 for a secured kill.

            Where is my Hu Tao

              your best bet is to pick a strong laner to enable ur cores to kill him. Sometimes it simple a good antimage game due to what your cores picked and there isnt much you can do.

              DC.MASON

                it's not that people's choice of supports against am is bad - get something that pressures him in lane while making sure that your team has the means to catch him

                but from what I've seen recently, people win the lane against him but don't do anything after so he just catches up and owns

                which is much easier to do with the T2 tower changes so his team doesn't lose map that easily, but in many games he's pressured far less than he should be

                Vladimir Putin

                  A team with an AM wants to spend part of the game fighting/pressuring as 4 while AM farms/pushes elsewhere. You do need some catch to deal with the AM, but you can also beat AM by shitting on his teammates with a strong teamfighter.

                  Sometimes trying to run around after the hero with a 6 second blink is the wrong approach.

                  This comment was edited
                  kowareta

                    Its time to cutting waves gets a nerf. Like creeps not getting aggrod or sth. That shit is too broken and everyone does that.

                    November.Rain

                      Pick mid game heroes, crush him in lane and then end the game at 20-25 min. Game going late increases his chances of winning drastically, regardless of what cores you have, how much 'catch' you have or how much you win team fights, because he can control the entire map all by himself once he has Bf, manta, abyssal, butter, boots of travels and an additional survivability item.

                      In fact, once he reaches that point, the only way he loses is because of incorrect decision-making on his part, or his team's, or miscalculations of intense physical burst, such as late game PA's, gyros with rapiers, etc. But such cases are very limited, for example, even late-game Sven or jugger can't do shit to him, and how he can dodge CK ult-stun-rift combo and kill CK, or perma-stun TB in metamorphosis, or jump around PL and Spectre. Which is why I made that point about how he wins regardless of whatever cores you try to counter him with.

                      The hero itself is made for controlling the late game, and on paper, should not lose a late game.

                      So the answer to your question is to not pick support heroes based on the mid or late game, and instead think primarily about the laning stage and then pushing at 20 min. Which means pick strong aggressors and pushers. Maybe stuff like jakiro, underlord, venge, etc. And graviitate more towards physical-focused rather than heroes who rely on magic. Ofc, every game is different, so you will need to think and improvise every time.

                      This comment was edited
                      ReHa

                        legend noob advice , shaker good for chasing am lmao.

                        Hatrið mun sigra

                          Hihihi why would a hero with a million stuns and a blink be good at chasing down AM hihihi so noob

                          kowareta

                            i just dont understand why u laughing at shaker when sky and aa are on the list :axe_laugh:

                            '96 Neve Campbell

                              Shaker, Spirit Breaker, Skywrath, Ogre, Lina, AA, Jakiro, Silencer

                              Literally all heros which get countered by AM lol

                              Hatrið mun sigra

                                So you're telling me that a Sky and Silencer with silence, a tanky SB with a bash and charge covering the entire map, an AA with stun and burst, along with Ogre, Lina and Shaker and a lane dominator with stun such as Jakiro are BAD at shutting down an Antimage EARLY GAME? Of course most of these heroes get in general countered by him, they're freaking int, mostly squishy, heroes. But OP asked to name SUPPORTS that shut him down EARLY GAME. These heroes have powerful disables, silences and nukes very early in the game. You guys trippin

                                '96 Neve Campbell

                                  But OP asked to name SUPPORTS that shut him down EARLY GAME

                                  No, OP asked for heros which are direct counters to flash farmers like Anti-Mage, not heros which are necessarily good against him early game.

                                  So you're telling me that a Sky and Silencer with silence

                                  Completely useless heros with no hard disables and gigantic mana pools which give AM a massive nuke, yeah great picks...

                                  tanky SB with a bash and charge covering the entire map

                                  Can be pretty good against AM but honestly any good AM can just kite him and SB is not brilliant against illusions.

                                  an AA with stun and burst

                                  Is perhaps the worst pick I can think of into an Anti-Mage. Literally only does magic damage which Anti-Mage resists, only has movement spells which AM counters with blink and can dispel anyway, and has an ult which doesnt do much cause AM doesnt normally build lifesteal until hes practically already won the game anyway.

                                  along with Ogre

                                  Bad pick, only does magic damage which you resist and all of his casts have large wind-up times and are super easy to deflect with spell shield, ignite is possibly the easiest ability to bounce back in the entire game.

                                  Lina

                                  Predominantly does magic damage early game which you counter, and late game is a useless walking 3000 mana pool nuke for you to blow up.

                                  Shaker

                                  This one is a fine pick, strong undispellable lockdown.

                                  Jakiro

                                  Pretty good in lane against AM, walking food later.

                                  Of course most of these heroes get in general countered by him, they're freaking int, mostly squishy, heroes.

                                  Yes, which is why you would have to be stupid to pick these heros into an Anti-Mage.

                                  As for actual counters which remain effective all game versus an Anti-Mage; I would suggest Mirana, Venomancer, Bounty Hunter, Bane and Beastmaster.

                                  One mirana arrow will almost always kill an anti-mage with backup, Venomancer does persisting heavy damage, wrecks his lane phase and then makes it difficult for Anti-Mage to escape later in the game, either he fights too long and then dies to your ult when he disengages, or it prevents him from engaging and re-engaging at a whim. Bounty Hunter is able to track him when he blinks through trees and Beastmaster and Bane both have powerful manta countering disables. Honourbale mention to Shadow Shaman also though he is easy to counter if you have a bkb.

                                  This comment was edited
                                  Arc

                                    Any pushing heroes could do the magic (jakiro, lina, shaman and ogre magi). The problem is supports tend to early pick and has no chance to counter pick. My only suggestion is shut down the farm and kill the lane ASAP. Once the carry retreated to jungle, force mid lane to be shut down and creating 2 farming priority (and the 2 will have to share farm or risking their life for lane). Also of course PTFO is the best way before the clock reach 35 minutes and AM 6 slotted destroy some scrubs

                                    Anonymous mode- No chat

                                      the real support counter to am at all stages is earth spirit. he reliably stuns and silences am for almost all parts of the game. You’ll have to spend some time practicing to play earth spirit well tho.

                                      '96 Neve Campbell

                                        he real support counter to am at all stages is earth spirit. he reliably stuns and silences am for almost all parts of the game. You’ll have to spend some time practicing to play earth spirit well tho.

                                        Would you not say that Earth Spirit is countered by manta and bkb though?

                                        A̶𝖘𝖍𝖊𝖘

                                          So whts the final list like Parma / SLQ?

                                          Shaker, Earth spirit, jakiro, SB I guess.It's getting tough to counter AM lately.

                                          Honestly as rough as pubs can be I still be the best counter to AM is teamwork esp in the early stages of the game, and no I am not saying that teamwork cant counter AM in the later stages , it definitely can.

                                          Illuminati

                                            You cant. AM can just blink abysall mana void u till dead. AM is the strongest carry right now and you can even win against faceless void, troll, lone druid and LC that supposed to counter him but it doesnt work like that (because this is 5 vs 5 duh)

                                            He need nerf to his 3rd skill, totally hell broken skill with 45% magic resist and 3 scd cooldown counterspell

                                            Illuminati

                                              ES, ES, jakiro,sb counter him?

                                              Blink->abysall->manta->Cring cring cring cring cring Chrasshh!(mana void)----And you're dead--

                                              --"I sunder this cabal"-Anti fkin mage

                                              Anonymous mode- No chat

                                                that’s not really the point isn’t it. Barely any support hero survives a fat AM jumping in on him with abyssal manta ult.

                                                The point is that the supports chosen has means to catch/stop AM when he’s farming or jumping someone outside BKB (BKB in fact is also pretty rare on AM unless as a 6th item in most pubs.

                                                The topic here is on supports that are good against AM even if he’s broken.

                                                Earth shaker isn’t as preferred to earth spirit tho. The time you take to farm a blink already gives AM a good head start, maybe even already BF manta.

                                                This comment was edited
                                                kowareta

                                                  is this ashes guy really stupid or he cant even stop licking pu$$ies on internet? goddamn this behavior is so pathetic

                                                  ETd

                                                    Bloodseeker pos 4

                                                    kowareta

                                                      YAAAAY, problem solved.
                                                      can i play him on 5 too sir?

                                                      ETd

                                                        Disruptor can early-midgame AM with a +1(max glimpse to catch his blink though, not sure if you wanna do that)
                                                        I'm thinking Shadow Demon to steal some mana-burning illusions for yourself but I doubt it's realistic

                                                        Ad.Goku™(tv/adgoku24)

                                                          From my experience playing AM(not much), Shadow demon absolutely rekts AM. In early game, 1 disruption and AM regrets taking mana burn. Late game, you can use those strong illus to fuck am's team. And the continuous dispelling + slow + break(scep) ulti is pretty oof for AM(no movement speed + no magic resistance + no mana burn). Also, the ability to instantly take 35% of current hp away.

                                                          Hatrið mun sigra

                                                            God forbid I learn how to quote stuff. Anyway to all those who talked about late game, AM's manta and abyssal, BKB and whatnot, you do realize that he needs to farm them first, right? And that the entire point of the post is shutting down such heroes. This means zoning him out of lane, ganking him while he's jungling right after it WHILE ending the game asap, this is why I gave for granted that we were talking about the early game. He shouldn't even have the time to farm such items. Don't think you can gank an AM for 45 minutes without ending the game and still win, he will eventually 100% come back. Imo this is the biggest mistake people make in low brackets. With this I'm also replying to the "but these heroes have huge mana pools and deal magic dmg". They do, they're supports, but AM is squishy af himself early game and only has to dare try to mana void into laguna blade, stuns, silences or AA's ult. Of course you don't walk up to him and manfight, you exploit vision and smokes and gank him at least as 2. Before he even works out the courage to join a fight with basher the game should be already over, preventing him from hitting his power spike and, only at that point, counter mana-dependent heroes.

                                                            fabi

                                                              you can dubster most hyper carrys with unding in lane but after that you cant do shit to them. Bane is good vs many hyper carry since you can always get that 1 game winning ult on the carry. Normally just push t1s fast, get smokes to get deep wards, try to kill the enemy carry but don't ruin ur deep wards with those kills. control you're offalane and slow siege t2( mostly just by pushing in creeps and control the area) and when ever the enemy hits you're t2 offline you get a free chance to kill him if you can predict it or see him on the way back with a good ward. then take rosh and win the game.

                                                              A̶𝖘𝖍𝖊𝖘

                                                                @ SLQ: You could just @ ppl..

                                                                A̶𝖘𝖍𝖊𝖘

                                                                  @Kowareta: Why are you on this thread if you have no good opinion to share. You are literally trolling on everyone's opinion here and talk about behavioue? Omegalol. I never knew chen(only) spammers in immortal bracket have so much ego , you are goddam a pathetic human being joblessly commenting on these forums nonstop!!

                                                                  kowareta

                                                                    im literally the first person who shared his opinion about the topic :axe_laugh:
                                                                    neither im trolling someone here, its reha who trolls slq
                                                                    i got my answer tho, dont mind me, keep simping.

                                                                    ETd

                                                                      ^Kowa was legit in his initial opinion, he started messing about when the stupidity came in

                                                                      Misa

                                                                        shadow demon???

                                                                        Hatrið mun sigra

                                                                          Where's the stupidity in exploiting such heroes' early game weakness and shutting them down with disables and nukes and most importantly preventing them from reaching their power spikes by ending the game asap you ape?