General Discussion

General DiscussionI think I know why underlord is so OP/high winrate

I think I know why underlord is so OP/high winrate in General Discussion
Murranji

    Despite being one of the least popular heroes underlord is only behind wraith king in average winrate.

    Past few patches have massively buffed his laning since he now has more armour, very high strength gain, better movespeed and atrophy aura has 1200 range.

    Since the hero just has to build tanks aura items and run around in fights casting q and w he quite often survives the fight.

    In 7.20 atrophy aura now gives permanent bonus damage if any hero dies under its effect, which can often mean 10-20 damage gained per team fight.

    Also if he lasts until the end of the fight he will often have around 300-400 bonus atrophy aura damage particularly in late game team fights where there are heaps of creeps and summons dying.

    With an aghs this then translates into a 200+ damage aura for any allied hero which makes any subsequent tower push very fast (not to mention during the team fight he and his allies start hitting harder and harder the longer it goes on).

    The fact he is barely picked (96th popularity) despite this insane strength seems to be because he’s a pretty boring hero who just presses two aoe spells and then activates items and then acts an attack magnet in team fights.

    Cheap Laugh Guy

      Now that you've mentioned
      He has ~50% winrate above 3k, but 66% below 2k
      Funny stats

      This comment was edited
      Murranji

        Also meteor hammer which has a 78% winrate on the hero and quite commonly bought is a very good and cheap item for underlord. Pit of malice -> meteor stun -> pit of malice gives 1.8+2+1.8 (about 6) seconds of full mobility impairment (enough to fully hit with all waves of firestorm which deal 32% of max hp as damage if hit by all waves.

        @one true merchant - yep would seem to be because low MMRs are so terrible at last hitting so the damage aura gives him easy farm and makes it so the enemy carry can't CS a single thing.

        This comment was edited
        kuci

          mk fucks him in lane and offlane rarely get the luxury to lastpick

          BUT ALSO I WON A GAME JUST BY EXISTING ASDFGDAQWJEIO
          https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/4834901876

          idk man i'm confused with this hero

          Yami Yugi

            Higher MMR just denied the creep showered by the meteor, unlike the lower bracket, so yeah he is niche up there, not that OP.

            Murranji

              I think the trick is to not cast the spell on the creeps during the laning stage, only when you want to push a lane. Otherwise just CS with his 100+ damage from level 2.

              Spírít

                You can look at the win rate for meteor hammer on almost ANY hero and it will be extremely high, it is a meme item and not a good reference for its actual strength.

                Underlord is strong because he scales really well with % max HP damage and % base damage reduction. He is a powerful aura buyer and items like Greaves + Pipe + Shivas are all super strong and with his Q he can easily farm up to these big items.

                He is under 50% win rate in divine+ because people counter pick with meta heroes and do not let him free farm. In crusader people flail around blindly for 30 minutes and by that point Underlord is fully farmed and nearly unstoppable.

                LucaManny

                  Ursa, razor, mk, lifestealer 100% fuck him

                  A̶𝖘𝖍𝖊𝖘

                    Underlord good hero, 100% winrate in recent minor and major. Pogu

                    DC.MASON

                      it's because he counters bloodseeker

                      HaylingZar

                        He has a lot of powerful counters, which are common meta picks anyway. If he is not countered he is hard to kill and focus down while giving his team lots of aura buffs. The best way to play against him if you do not counterpick is to deny all his creeps from firestorm in the laning stage and push early before he has many defensive items to protect him team.

                        Väinämöinen

                          you have to pick him early since he's the pos 3, in any decent mmr you will just get destroyed in lane because people are smart enough t just pick ursa or mk.

                          I pick the hero quite often because people still pick TB or PA anyway in 3k, which basically allows me to be unkillable in lane

                          LucaManny

                            Yeah i dont think anyone would give last pick to an pos 3 underlord

                            Grimm

                              people tend to think you can counter underlord with a slark on lane but you'll just destroy him if your 4 plays agressive

                              HartzFear

                                How can you counter underlord if his pos 4 is Oracle?

                                Oldman

                                  I think dark seer is much better choice in scenario you want to pick underlord. Seer can farm even faster, can play solo offlane and has a save mechanic.

                                  ROAD TO HERALD 0

                                    In crusader people flail around blindly for 30 minutes

                                    TRUE LULW

                                    Murranji

                                      So I think Underlord might get one more buff prior to TI.

                                      Icefraud clearly wants him in the meta. He's like pre-nerf Omniknight. So good but not super popular. I think most likely firestorm goes from 1/2/3/4% to 1.2/2.2/3.2/4.2% max damage or something like that.

                                      azmarco

                                        Underlord?
                                        is nice