General Discussion

General DiscussionMKB first item on Windranger (ana build)

MKB first item on Windranger (ana build) in General Discussion
Talker

    I saw MKB as first item on Windranger by Ana recently. Like yea, they were owning the game, but I dont see the reasoning behind it. There was no evasion hero (or evasion actives like troll or some radiance naix), so only option was some late game butterfly or some other items.

    For the price of MKB you can have maelstrom and already saved up 1500 gold for blink/start aghs/any other item.

    Yes, the magic damage of MKB is nice, but early maelstrom feels great as well and helps you push, farm, clear waves as well. With MKB you only have chance on farming with powershot or heroes. I tried it before and worked well only when MKB was giving AS instead of damage.

    Other thing I noticed is he maxed out Windrun and took shackleshot lvl 9. Is that the right progression? I prefer going agresive with stun and only 1-2 points in windrun and maxing it out last.

    As well why people go powershot damage lvl 15 talent - at that time as core (mid or offlane) your main source of damage is from right click (ulti) and the range is as well statwise superior (+1.9% winrate).

    Lately I prefer talents Mana regen - range - stun duration (if I have blink) and CD reduction. Only options to change it (as a core) are if you have CM in your team to sustain your mana (and you get bottle), so you dont go mana regen or going for invis (if you dont have any other invis hero so they dont have so many wards).

    This topic was edited
    kowareta

      u farm and push with ur powershot, u dont have a enough AS for maelstorm, ur hero is not agile!
      i dont know about ana, but mkb > maelstorm

      dark echo

        pros experiment. that do things differently to see if it would work even in minors/majors. if u watch miracle, he will be in a spot he knows he will be ganked and he knows he will die but its all part of thinking differently and trying new things. some times dying is actualy good

        kuci

          It's fuckin ana what do you want to point out? Dude has 97% win rate with ember spirit probably can do anything he wanted

          Player 281121816

            How about diffusal? That thing is good, active slow, mana burn, cheap cost, not affected by ulti dmg reduction

            No mana ->dead hero

            Cheap Laugh Guy

              MKB=4175, Maelstrom=2700. 1475 gold difference.
              Maelstrom on WR isn't compulsory. You can wave clear by hitting the creeps a few times then Powershot(one of the reasons why the Powershot damage talent is always taken).
              It's not mindboggling to save up 1475 more gold to go for more single target damage.

              About Shackleshot, I feel like the skill is underwhelming these days. For some reason, getting Blink on cores is a taboo this meta, hence it's hard to land shackle when you're buying Maelstrom/MKB/Orchid/Diffu + Aghs first.

              Talent build should always be mana-powershot-invis-CDR
              Invis windrun helps you initiate better, land Shackle and escape. +1s for shackle is a joke.

              IM JUST A SUP

                because whatever the pros build is always right

                matrice

                  diffu was nice when you couldn't move during ult, now between the fact you can run after your prey, and the reduced as from ult, you actually don't even fully manaburn heroes such as am/jugg during a shackel shot. (I was actually building it a lot back then, and if consider that javelin is actually extra super too good, it make no more sens to buy diffu)

                  And yeah, maelstrom is compulsory on windranger, as mjolnir is compulsory for late game. You can own really hard lategame with mjolnir and agahnims as sole dps item. Mjolnir will give you tremendous aoe damage in teamfight late game (and you'll be able to continously attack thx to a tanky build). And no1 can 1v1 you (but tinker ^^), cause you have almost perma invis and perma haste, while moving while shooting.

                  You can ofc go for a more risky build, where you add some item like mkb / daedalus / bloodthorn and go all out on dps, but you'll almost 100% need to buy both bkb and linken then, in which case maelstrom isn't the best item (but stay decent !), but those build aimed at fast solo killing a target are quite often crippled very hard by a single linken sphere (and they have a very bad time at recovering if something went wrong)

                  This comment was edited
                  Himas bayabas <3

                    Ana PRO and TI CHAMP. End of discussion

                    Talker

                      @kill twice
                      1500 gold is pretty significant difference – not just that you have it around 4 minutes earlier, but as well you can use this maelstrom for couple of minutes to farm, which boosts you much more – with a bit of luck with maelstrom you need couple less shots to farm the wave and then kill the neutral and move for another wave with powershot ready. The difference can be 100GPM during these 3-4 minutes and later on for farming I believe it is still better, so instead of having MKB+aghs 25 minutes into the game you will have maelstrom, aghs and crystalis at the same time which is more GPM & more teamfight damage & probably more single target damage – with possibility to scale into Mjolnir + bloodthorn/buriza.

                      Regarding the talents – mana is pretty obvious, same goes for CD reduction lvl 25, but the second talent is pretty open. For example attack range has almost 2% advantage in winrate – I guess one of the reasons is that it is go to talent when you are in bad shape and the range wouldn’t help you, but still. Regarding invis/stun the winrate is slightly on the stun duration (0.4%), as the good shackles just makes sure enemy is out of teamfight for 4.8 seconds, which gives you more time. Invis is good, it is my go to talent when we don’t have invis heroes/SB heroes

                      Jacked

                        I used to like rushing mkb on certain ranged heroes. Like clinks. It’s not totally out of this world. Yes I think you should still go mael on wr.

                        Cheap Laugh Guy

                          Maelstrom will always be a solid choice and there's no arguing that.
                          MKB still deals insane single target damage without Aghs, so since he's winning and having the momentum why not go for that sweet burst damage. It's not that detrimental to his farm since he has Powershot too, with the lvl15 talent.
                          Part of his reasoning is probably because it's fun too.
                          Did he have Tread or Phase btw?

                          Also... Can't wait to see OG stomp Disneyland. 100% TI8 champs roster baby! Gonna rekt Team Secret and VP EZ

                          Jacked

                            Can’t even beat bots though lul

                            Cheap Laugh Guy

                              EZ Rekt VP best TI winners in the history of Dota

                              oldjeans

                                If you watch his replays on Youtube, you will realize that his playstyle involves gaining some advantage in the laning stage and then using that to constantly pressure underfarmed heros and turn around fights. I think that explains his choice of damage over farming and him levelling up windrun.

                                Cheap Laugh Guy

                                  Oopsie OG LUL

                                  Where is my Hu Tao

                                    should play it like pango the 6 javelin build LOL

                                    mute all

                                      sumail always go for maels then he will go for mkb..then blink to linkens..or bkb..

                                      $ραятαn

                                        You can actually clear waves super quickly with mkb and powershot dmg, malestorm is okayish for farming but mkb is really good against heroes and u can easily solo their pos 1 with mkb only. Also lategame when you have shortage of slots, mjolnir feels very mediocre in terms of damage.

                                        Cheap Laugh Guy

                                          Tried Sumail's build, genius build.