General Discussion

General Discussionphysics problem - condensers

physics problem - condensers in General Discussion
DC.MASON

    can someone please explain to me what am i suppsoed to do with this? we have series of condensers that look like this

    how exactly do i put this into one? especially around the C3 C7 C8 part

    ywn

      incomprehensible ive met with a terrible fate

      DC.MASON

        also the capacities of condensers are not written on purpose, im looking for how to do it

        i know obvious steps like putting C13 and C14 and then C13C14 with C4 together but im not sure if i can just throw C1 and C5 as parallel and pretend that it's in together in one line

        зачем я начал поиск

          Assume their capacities are qx for every Cx capacitor. E.g. q1 for C1, etc.

          I barely remember it, but we had a huge electronics course and would routinely solve stuff like that.

          Maybe I could give you a full solution later.

          Do you need to just simplify this?

          This comment was edited
          DC.MASON

            if you could give me step by step solution how to simplify it, i would be very thankful

            i remember having electricity in high school but it covered a little simpler circuits and i probably cant apply it on this because it just stops making sense at some points (like the c3c7c8 part i talked about previously, that little horizontal connection in the middle screws me up completely)

            Soggy Coochie Enthusiast

              You bundle up condensers lined up in series first
              Next you bundle them up by parallel
              Sort of like MDAS

              Soggy Coochie Enthusiast

                the main guideline here when you line up stuff in a circuit in series is that if they could be lined up in one line they can go as series, whereas if at least 3 of those intersect into a "T" they shouldn't be grouped up in series.. let me try to draw something up to explain further hoping I make sense

                TheMaverick427

                  Its been a while since I've done this sort of stuff and I'm from mech eng anyway so I might be wrong about this:

                  The C7 C3 C8 can be simplified like that, where C7 is in parallel with an empty line and C8 and C3 are in parallel with each other. Then the C7+Blank combo is in series with the C8 C3 combo. So to solve that you combine C7 in parallel with an empty wire. You combine C8 and C3 in parallel. Then you combine the two parallel combinations in series.

                  Hopefully that makes sense, its kinda difficult to explain in text.

                  To solve the rest of it, start from the right had side and work back. C14 and C13 in series, that in parallel with C4, then all that is in series with C11 and C12. All of those will then be in parallel with your simplified C3C7C8 combo, and so on.

                  I recommend drawing a new diagram after each simplification, it really makes it easier to visualise this all.

                  Edit: tried to draw a text picture but its incomprehensible

                  This comment was edited
                  Soggy Coochie Enthusiast





                    you might want to group them up along vertically just so it's easy to look at

                    Soggy Coochie Enthusiast

                      god if I'm wrong at this...

                      Falter

                        C3 and C8 are parallel to each other and C7 is in series with the C3||C8

                        dunce

                          äh?

                          DC.MASON

                            @maverick
                            thanks a lot, seems like the trick with empty condenser is the way to solve it

                            @doge
                            i dont think that this makes any sense tbh

                            TheMaverick427

                              @ Dog I'm almost certain that C8 and C12 can't be placed in series since technically they all form a T with C15 and/or C3. Same story with C3 and C15. But like I said its been a long time since I did this stuff so I might be mistaken

                              Falter
                                This comment was deleted
                                Soggy Coochie Enthusiast

                                  you might be better off asking on quora just for good measure, tons of people who know their shit there(albeit answer construction is too cringy for my taste, cringier than yahoo answers even)

                                  Soggy Coochie Enthusiast

                                    I think c8 and c12 can be placed in series since they have a separate wing of the "T" on their own, same as with c15-c3. if say we only had c8 and then c15 and c12 on both sides we wouldn't be able to line up any of them in series at all.

                                    🍩🍪Cookie🍪🍩

                                      here: all i did was parallel and series connections, if you can't figure out what i did between the pictures i'll add labels

                                      c3 and c8 are in parallel and c7 beginning and end point are the same so you can disregard it

                                      don't quote me on this.

                                      This comment was edited
                                      ywn

                                        wtf is this even xD

                                        Falter

                                          Tip to solve this:
                                          1) Start from the extreme left side of the circuit and simplify things from that side.

                                          I'll be using '+' for series and '||' for parallel connection, use the corresponding formula to find net capacitance.

                                          Note that C7 is parallel to a short circuit so we can discard C7.
                                          That gives us:

                                          ((C13+C14)||C4)+C11+C12 = Cx

                                          Now,
                                          (C3||C8)+C10+C15 = Cy

                                          And,
                                          (C9+C16)||(C2+C6)+C1+C5 = Cz

                                          Net capacitance = Cx||Cy||Cz
                                          There you have it.

                                          Feel free to correct me if you think I'm wrong.

                                          This comment was edited
                                          TheMaverick427

                                            Cookies seems to be correct although it doesn't tell you if things get combined in series or parallel. But the order he simplifies looks right.

                                            @ Falter, Shouldn't the second step be Cx||(C3||C8) ? And after that you add C10 and C15 in series to get (Cx||C8||C3)+C10+C15

                                            🍩🍪Cookie🍪🍩

                                              i'll add in labels, give me a minute

                                              haven't checked for mistakes, so just check by yourself

                                              This comment was edited
                                              TheMaverick427

                                                Looks correct Cookie.

                                                BenaoLifedancer

                                                  Isn't there a set of rules you have to follow? Just do that

                                                  And I think what cookie did looks logical from my point of view even though I don't know anything about circuits. In any case, it should be right.

                                                  DC.MASON

                                                    yeah it seems correct
                                                    hopefully my friend who's having an exam from this tomorrow will understand this but i dont think it can get more comprehensible than this

                                                    thank you cookie

                                                    🍩🍪Cookie🍪🍩

                                                      if he can speak bosnian there's a guy solving and explaining these kinds of equations on fetp.ba

                                                      if not, then there should be stuff on khanacademy

                                                      This comment was edited
                                                      ywn

                                                        such a good person arin

                                                        i have 5 reports to use

                                                          Have you set it to wombo?

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                                                            School kids these days..

                                                            Sia

                                                              Holy shit man i cant understand a full sentence in scinece and math in english xd

                                                              Anomaluna

                                                                I didn't know you guys call them condensers. We call them capacitors.

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