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Mutombo
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    RichPlz

      So ah.... what? Wisp is good... but not.... good enough?

      Swole Gamer | NO CARDIO |...

        every wisp player just feeds

        m3me_fr0g

          The main problem with Wisp is that n0tail now plays carry.

          In all seriousness, there probably *is* a problem in having a hero that for any given team is either unplayable or a 100% first phase ban. The only time Wisp is ever particularly interesting from a draft perspective is when both teams can play it well, and even then usually one of them will ban it.

          It's disappointing, because there's nothing cooler than seeing great Wisp play, just like there's nothing cooler than seeing any great player play their best hero. Unfortunately, in 2017, it seems that any remotely good Wisp player just gets Wisp first-phase-banned in every game and 'having a Wisp player' actually just means forcing a ban from your opponent, which is strong but not the same.

          MagicHugsTV

            It can work in pubs :P

            Quinkerros

              No. I just got the exclusive Arcana in the last Battle Pass :D

              Isaías Cancino

                For pro players, IceFrog could add some sort of damage reduction to buildings for wisp and the hero it's tethered to during relocate. No more "tier 3 and rax down" in 12 seconds.

                This comment was edited
                Crunchy

                  The points brought up do not reflect on Wisp as a hero, but rather on the community at large. Wisp sits at the 111th most played hero, only beaten by Beast Master and Chen. Most players will not play these heroes because they believe they are "high-skill only heroes", or that their team is trash and won't know how to play with them. Indeed, they require a high degree of coordination and skill, but does that warrant a change in the hero? Rather, players should look to themselves to take on the challenges of difficult to play heroes, and not wait for developers to dumb down heroes for less skilled players.

                  Simply put, pros are pros for a reason, because they are better than the average Dota player. Of course pros will perform better on heroes with high skill caps, because they understand the game better and have dedicated coordination. You cannot compare a pro team of 5 seasoned players to a pub team of 5 randomly matched players. Suggesting to change a hero because of this skill gap is ridiculous. If Valve is in the business of dumbing down heroes, might as well remove the micro element from Chen, BM, and Visage, the other members of the 4 least played heroes.

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                  Innocent

                    Wisp is actually good in low mmr pubs if you focus on Tether+Overcharge and don't stress about Relocate and balls. His sustain is unrivaled! Paired up with a tanky hero that usually has mana pbs, like Sven, it's brutal.

                    If you like the hero, slowly start working your way thrpugh his other skills. Keep relocate ganks to last, but relocate saves are easier and less risky.

                    Edge

                      I myself struggle to remember Wisp picked, when i marked my chen picks. Always loved the pair with sendbacks, heals, rotations with potentially immobile heroes. Not an Io player,but seeing a good one is pleasure. :)
                      Sad to have people sticking to easier hero choices - may grant high reward, but boring as hell though...

                      MM.Brock Hall

                        Dota, if anything, is, strangely, a game of balance. Oftentimes it feels very unbalanced, but in the end everything has its place. Techies feels very outside of Dota in many senses, but few heroes can be as effective at ruining a gank lineup as Techies can. If you have no detection or good source of wave clear, you better ban out Broodmother. Niche heroes don't need to be reworked. They fill a spot that nothing else quite does, and although they don't fill much else, losing their skillset in the game would open up a huge hole in the balance of the game.

                        It's more than ok that a hero is unpopular, so long as it can be proven that they have a reason to be in the game as they are. Wisp has proven this easily, and it is up to pub players to recognize and adapt to the hero, not the other way around.

                        Oh, and while I get why the author brought up Chen at the end of the article, Chen is still largely unplayed as well. I'm not sure it proved his point.

                        m3me_fr0g

                          "For pro players, IceFrog could add some sort of damage reduction to buildings for wisp and the hero it's tethered to during relocate. No more "tier 3 and rax down" in 12 seconds."

                          So it could go from being a barely-played hero that is powerful in some hands to a completely useless hero that is completely shit?

                          Parteculos

                            Antoher thing to note is that lich is a counter to io, missplace one blink and you'll eat full ultimate. And lich is a plague this days...

                            Food distributor

                              Lich aghs gives me nightmares

                              Potato PC

                                IO/wisp need small buff on 1st/3rd skill and an aghanim would be great

                                Edit : the writer never play IO/wips, but made an article about it.

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                                Frency

                                  Io is hard to use, that's why it has a low win rate in the public games. Unless you do a lot of practice, you won't get a good score and / or performance. it has a high win rate in the official tournaments because, differently from the "public " games, those guys who are paid to play, practice that hero (and other supports) a lot and they are supposed to be good. End of the story.

                                  feeder reporter

                                    of course Complexity qualified with Io. Limmp is a beast on that combo pair

                                    P9^

                                      Good post eggs,i had topic about this here,its disadvantage for us that hero require so much compare to others,he is kinda pro games only hero,and that example of lich is good i like it,shows stupidity of Dota makes low skill cap heroes just so strong compare to io,necro sitting on high winrate so buff him....thats how it works

                                      Geshtapo

                                        IO is great if you know how to use it as a support+ganker

                                        it provides mana and HP reg as well and somehow is a great counter for Doom and Venomancer Ulti and can help your teammates to survive from those strong ultimates.

                                        Rick J19Z7

                                          Yo espero un reseña para el puck

                                          Rainbow Dash

                                            No.........

                                            Simple

                                              Help me,I've MMR 1k

                                              Valom

                                                wisps spells are incredibly strong in the right hands, but they also feel incredibly outdated. I'd love to see some quality of life updates for the little ball.

                                                ETdAWESOME

                                                  Io mid. Not even joking about this one. Heroes have gotten role swaps before; more recently, we're seeing the pos 3 and 4 mixups. Why not try it?

                                                  m3me_fr0g

                                                    Don't know why I have to keep saying it over and over again: DotA is not balanced around pubs, thank God. And Wisp is balanced in pro DotA.

                                                    RPQ-sama

                                                      Can dotabuff get people who are at least about 5-6k to write articles? Because this is at best 3k logic.

                                                      EDIT: Yup, author of this article is 3.8k, who would have known.

                                                      This comment was edited
                                                      Cover LastLow

                                                        No need for a rework. Its hard to play a good wisp, and its fine like that.
                                                        I feel like a lot people think it doesnt do anything, so they dont even consider trying it.

                                                        Od1n

                                                          Why does it matter what mmr is the author? He is right.

                                                          I am a wisp player, i love playing it but its terribly nerfed.
                                                          And if u also nerf some of his best pairs - Tiny / CK / Gyro / Sven, u get an overall 37 % winrate on pubs with wisp, which is very low and by far requires some rework / buff on wisp.
                                                          Imo, better Str progression or Armor progression should do it...

                                                          I know is terribly low because at the top of Winrate chart is Spectre with 56% winrate (only 6% over 50). At the end is Wisp with 37% (so 13% below 50).

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                                                          Od1n

                                                            + i remember the times when tether had stun instead of slow...Great times for Wisp...

                                                            Potato PC

                                                              I agree, IO is nerfed, especially recent update nerf all skill (slower movement speed bonus, higher mana cost, higher mana/health drain and higher relocate delay).

                                                              SirFalcon

                                                                IO has been nothing but nerfed for the last 3 years. And in all the wrong places making him worthless in pubs and still OP in pros. Frog needs to buff it's damage so it can be played in pubs while not effecting it's utility that the pros crave.

                                                                Herbert Richers

                                                                  IO is very strong and useful as it is. Plus, it's balanced. If they rework it, it might be hard to get it balanced again. Plus, the % of success with it depends on the player, not on the hero. Take Earth Spirit for example, people claim he is too hard but don't even know exactly how he works. I say it's fine, and if the % of success is low then so be it. It gives an advantage to good Wisp players.

                                                                  Yanes

                                                                    Crappy hero

                                                                    Ssna

                                                                      SAD VERY HIGH SKILL !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! MAX OPEN MMR 3.500 !!! FUCKING DOTA 2 ....

                                                                      ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ

                                                                        eggs, you haven't ever played the hero before, and you're writing about how it's time for a rework? Why? Io has his place in the game, and reworking him would change the dynamic of the competitive scene entirely, not to mention a slap in the face of all those who's put hundreds of hours into the hero to mastered it, like Lil, GH, Jerax etc. You can't just rework a hero because he's too hard for public players to master.

                                                                        Insert C01n

                                                                          Tbh, good old Guardian Wisp is actually my absolut favorite hero in this game. For me it's the definition of a support hero and like Brock Hall already wrote, Wisp does not need a rework. Complex but not too criptic, if the situation fits, pick it. I have only two wishes relating to Wisp: Please raise its strength grow/level or give him a little more starting armor.

                                                                          Decarabia

                                                                            The problem is not on the wisp, it is the player, pub especially. We still lack many thing, especially map awareness. We often see some player still smashing the jungle while the teamfight occur near him. While bottle is core for him, none of the teammate allow io to farm for it, and always pinging him to ward and ward. In coordinated team (pro), this is less likely to happen.

                                                                            And anyway, who cares about author mmr? His last game is in 2015, who knows maybe he has another account and use this account only for writing purpose?

                                                                            PACEKBA

                                                                              just looking at the title i can say no. we are not fucking league, IF wont fucking care about pubs ever. wisp is good in pro play and in FPL (which is a better version of ranked for pros)

                                                                              ok

                                                                                for me as a wisp player the challenge is what makes this hero interesting for me. Nothing gives more satisfaction than getting better in your plays when it takes a long time to get there. You are crazy for suggesting, this is like saying hey invoker is hard to master, let's change the hero.

                                                                                kiatahi

                                                                                  Since I'm in a low mmr bracket (2k) pretty no one understands how to work as a team, making wisp rather hard to play with, and there is always 1 support and 4 cores, making it that most io's have to safelane cause everyone else is selfish and won't help support