General Discussion

General Discussioncan someone set the record straight please

can someone set the record straight please in General Discussion
Soyaaa_

    i always hear ppl in my bracket, SEA server say shit like pick tank. or pick stun. it pisses me off because I see good players have a lineup of "Soft" heroes, or heroes with no reliable disables and they still manage to play around their draft.

    why do normal skill people have this drafting mentality? do better players have the same mentality? is it a more reliable strategy to always have a stun and a "tank"?

    ? EL MEJOR

      Yes , if u don't have proper disables then the game will be difficult . imagine that u r playing against an ember or storm spirit , they can zip zap around the map like anything if u don't have stuns or hex's . also u will see that if u dont have stun then ur enemy shadow shaman will TP on ur face . according to me 1 stun is good choice , however u can win game without stuns anyway with euls, basher,etc

      King of Low Prio

        bullshit Dr J heroes without disables get other advantages to compensate acting like it is a requirement is dumb

        sayaka

          whether u need stuns depends on what heroes they have and what ur lineup is supposed to do.
          eg. maybe if ure playing vs ember u want some instant stuns, but then maybe you are running a push lineup so you can completely ignore ember and just hit buildings, or maybe they have very good turtle so you need catch (stuns) before u can push bla bla bla

          not too sure about tanks or whatnot but IMO having bulky cores allows you to have a strong frontline which makes it alot easier for your supports to cast their spells and not get gone on, especially if they dont have strong gap closers/disengage it makes ur backline very safe. for example if you have a viper/razor hitting towers and absorbing some spells your frail supports (esp those with lots of spells to cast) like shadow shaman etc will find it easier to do stuff without dying. having a frontliner is also good in terms of being able to provide extra vision as well as allowing you to push. ofc all these matters less if your gameplan is to split push and everything

          ~example from one of the video leaks from vg during ti, they were commenting on how eg's ppd and zai could always do so much during teamfights because ppd always picked tanky cores for rtz like dk/viper/razor

          a good portion of the bulky cores also possess control which for some heroes can be especially useful for intiaition/smoke breaking like dk, plus the control allows for the team to not break formation/get ran down as easily

          This comment was edited
          Soyaaa_

            @dr.j but you are normal skill. lol

            @triple star
            okay. i get that bulky cores are good. so it definitely is easier to play around that, get your spells off and stuff, which is probably why normal skill dudes like it so much.

            but what is the trade-off. there has to be one if not every strat should get a bulky core right? to me it doesnt make sense if a core can do damage + be tanky. doesnt sound balanced.

            Delacroixz

              There is no such thing as a "Tank".. this is MOBA not a MMO
              It's just a retarded term that SEA players use cause those simple minded retard thinks Initiator = Tank

              as for stuns, it actually depends on how u wanna play, it's just that playing hero with reliable stuns make the line up of the team more simple to play with rather than playing with skill shots.. yes most of the time skill shots has more reward when it lands but it take a lot of skill to play around it, not only your skill but also the team in general to play around it, which in solo que its sometimes difficult cause you don't know who you got que with

              it's not about mentality or something, it's just about people trying to win and work around heroes they comfortable playing and playing with.. with simple stuns and "tanky" initiator its always easier to play with which is the basic thing in MOBA

              Dire Wolf

                You don't have to have stuns or tanks, but your lineup has to make sense. That's why it's easier to just draft a typical carry mid, disabler offlane, two disabler/nuker supports and a hard carry and win. Cus it can fight any opposing lineup.

                Like here:

                http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/2138783420

                Our lineup is not awful per say, but when you look at the opposing team we have nothing to counter bristleback. No stuns, can't maintain his facing, his quills just annihilate us. No disables mean their melees just run down me and pugna. Pretty bad draft. And PA is awful vs like their entire team cept maybe sky.

                xX420bootywizuurddXx

                  "There is no such thing as a "Tank".. this is MOBA not a MMO
                  It's just a retarded term that SEA players use cause those simple minded retard thinks Initiator = Tank"

                  Pretty much..

                  It's common to see top tier teams drafting with no real "tank" or durable heroes.. I guess the reason for this is that they can position really well most of the time and they don't really need 1 hero to just take all the damage, they just shuffle accordingly, and they tend to have better sustain.

                  The use of a few stuns, or just lockdown in general is more fundamental to ur team imo.. you'd want AT LEAST 1 stun or a few slows to catch out opponents & for other obvious reasons.

                  I feel really comfortable on perma-stun teams (Shaker + Lina + Sven etc) but that's just my humble scrub preference..